Fastest N/A 2v MN12??? - Page 2 - TCCoA Forums

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post #31 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-27-2012, 11:51 PM
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I think JL and I are the only ones that have ran faster than a 12.50.

JL's car had Comp 270's and 4200 RPM TC. I have the exact same TC ad he did. Our cars are very similar except, cams, displacement and oil pump...

R.I.P. Johnny Langton (1975 - 2011)

1996 Thunderbird 5.0L 2V-4R70W
12.64 @ 107 MPH -> DA 3315 Ft above Sea level
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post #32 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 05:03 AM
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Originally Posted by TGJ View Post
I think JL and I are the only ones that have ran faster than a 12.50.

JL's car had Comp 270's and 4200 RPM TC. I have the exact same TC ad he did. Our cars are very similar except, cams, displacement and oil pump...
Yes, I remember that yours has run very well too. Yours is NPI? Excellent numbers. I see you also run at higher DA. What is your set up?

Steve
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post #33 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 08:58 AM
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The fastest is j/l.
Some are trying to get there as well.
Pump gas(e85), N/A.
Power adder = turbo, blower, nitrous only.
My crap box was with all options working.(a/c, p/s)
j/l is running a little higher rpm.
See below.

Quickest N/A Modular MN12.
11.97@ 109.35
3880 lbs. w/driver.

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post #34 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 09:59 AM
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The fastest is j/l.
Some are trying to get there as well.
Pump gas(e85), N/A.
Power adder = turbo, blower, nitrous only.
My crap box was with all options working.(a/c, p/s)
j/l is running a little higher rpm.
See below.
Rick and TGJ. Are you all 4.6's????? I know you are 2V. TFS, PI or NPI?

Regardless, still great numbers.

Steve
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post #35 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:11 AM Thread Starter
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What is the biggest difference between the npi and pi motors besides the compression.

Was JL motor a complete npi motor or pi heads on a npi bottom end.

97 LX
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Working out the bugs right now.

R.I.P.
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post #36 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Stuckinkaos07 View Post
What is the biggest difference between the npi and pi motors besides the compression.

Was JL motor a complete npi motor or pi heads on a npi bottom end.

Justin,

JL's car had Non-PI heads (Non-Performance Improved). I don't know if anyone on here other than K. Danner who likely knows what the true bottom end of the engine was. I know once JL did tell me the NPI heads were fully ported and polished, big cams, Bullitt Intake that was ported by the same place and various other things. He also used a lot of converter and gear.

Besides that he was well into the tuning.

He also told me that he turned a lot of RPM around 68-7000 with it. It was set up very well, he knew how to get every ounce out of the car both driving and tuning, and he had a very good track to run on at HRP to run numbers in good weather. He sure made the combination work whatever the bottom end was.

Steve
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post #37 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuckinkaos07 View Post
What is the biggest difference between the npi and pi motors besides the compression.

Was JL motor a complete npi motor or pi heads on a npi bottom end.
There isn't THAT much difference in compression. The NPI engine is about 9.2:1 while the PI is 9.3-9.4:1 depending on what year PI engine.

JL had Renegade Ported NPI heads on an NPI block; I always suspected he had either flat-top or 4v pistons.

He was so fast cause he had a ported Bullitt Intake, aftermarket cams, U/D pullies, CAI, 80mm LMAF, dual exhaust, an awesome tune and to put it to the ground - Jmod, 4000 stall converter, matrix drive-shaft, trac-lok, and I don't know what gears...

Like I said, I don't know what pistons, rear gears, or exhaust headers he ran.

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Last edited by NetKeym; 11-28-2012 at 11:38 AM.
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post #38 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:35 AM
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There isn't THAT much difference in compression. The NPI engine is about 9.2:1 while the PI is 9.3-9.4:1 depending on what year PI engine.

JL had Renegade NPI heads on an NPI block.
Yeah, he had an NPI block. What was in the NPI Block? What was the build? I don't know and likely neither does anyone else but Kris. You think thats what the compression was on that motor?

Whatever it was it worked!

Steve
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post #39 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by 1MTNCAT View Post
Yeah, he had an NPI block. What was in the NPI Block? What was the build? I don't know and likely neither does anyone else but Kris. You think thats what the compression was on that motor?

Whatever it was it worked!
Like I said, I suspect he ran either the flat-top 0cc pistons that came in 1999-2004 Navigator 5.4L DOHC or the 2.66cc 4v pistons from the 1993-98 Mark VIII. So the answer to your question about the static compression - heck no I don't think it was stock!

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Last edited by NetKeym; 11-28-2012 at 11:47 AM.
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post #40 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:52 AM
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Like I said, I suspect he ran either the flat-top 0cc pistons that came in 1999-2004 Navigator 5.4L DOHC or the 2.66cc 4v pistons from the 1993-98 Mark VIII. So the answer to your question about the static compression - heck no I don't think it was stock! lol
I agree, that or more and I also suspect it was an aluminum block too! Likely around 12-13.1. Without a doubt he proved if the NPI's were worked they could flow with the PI's.

Steve
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post #41 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 12:10 PM
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I know for a while he was trying to get rid of a set of 93 Mark VIII pistons and rods...

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post #42 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 01:20 PM Thread Starter
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Ok, so I got everything he had besides the intake and the compression.

Now I got an idea....

97 LX
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Working out the bugs right now.

R.I.P.
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post #43 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 01:41 PM
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Ok, so I got everything he had besides the intake and the compression.

Now I got an idea....
You may have and idea but no, you don't!

Steve
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Previous Best 12.94 @ 105.25 1.81 60', Naturally Aspirated April 2012 (254 HP, 315 TQ)

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post #44 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 01:47 PM
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You may have and idea but no, you don't!
ehh, why not?
so you're saying you know what hes thinking? awesome.

what number am i thinking right now?

Nick......................I'm back!!!
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rest in peace JL
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post #45 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 01:59 PM
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ehh, why not?
so you're saying you know what hes thinking? awesome.

what number am i thinking right now?
He's thinking that is what he needs to get there on JL's numbers. He's not got all JL had by far, at least not yet. Compression, Intake are part of the equation, Cams and block are another issue, tuning ability is another, etc.

You aren't just going to throw pistons and intake on the car and go there is all I'm saying. It's not just that simple. I'm sure at some point someone will get there.

Steve
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post #46 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 02:30 PM
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JL posted what pistons he used, etc...

Congrats MR Langton Making MMFF Sept Issue

JL was running a plastic PI intake recently with a very similar setup to mine...

I am running a 5.0L Big-Bore and here is my build thread

Another Bad *** N/A NPI Modular

My car runs on Shell 91 Octane fuel and shifts at 6500 RPM. I run proper racing wheels and tires, bypass the power steering and remove my sub-box from the trunk as well as the spare tire, jack. I run anywhere between a 1/4 to 1/2 tank of fuel, sometimes less.

R.I.P. Johnny Langton (1975 - 2011)

1996 Thunderbird 5.0L 2V-4R70W
12.64 @ 107 MPH -> DA 3315 Ft above Sea level
12.49 @ 109 -> DA 2967 Ft above Sea level
2005 Mustang GT 4.6L 3V-TR3650 - SOLD
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post #47 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 03:17 PM Thread Starter
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You may have and idea but no, you don't!
I know steve....im just thinkin in my head.

97 LX
Motor and trans from 95
Working out the bugs right now.

R.I.P.
1995 Thunderbird LX. Black
BEST MOTOR TIMES
12.76 @ 105
BEST NITROUS
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post #48 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 03:18 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TGJ View Post
JL posted what pistons he used, etc...

Congrats MR Langton Making MMFF Sept Issue

JL was running a plastic PI intake recently with a very similar setup to mine...

I am running a 5.0L Big-Bore and here is my build thread

Another Bad *** N/A NPI Modular

My car runs on Shell 91 Octane fuel and shifts at 6500 RPM. I run proper racing wheels and tires, bypass the power steering and remove my sub-box from the trunk as well as the spare tire, jack. I run anywhere between a 1/4 to 1/2 tank of fuel, sometimes less.
Im not worried about your numbers since you have a 4.6 turned it a 5.0

97 LX
Motor and trans from 95
Working out the bugs right now.

R.I.P.
1995 Thunderbird LX. Black
BEST MOTOR TIMES
12.76 @ 105
BEST NITROUS
12.12 @ 109 mph
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post #49 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TGJ View Post
JL posted what pistons he used, etc...

Congrats MR Langton Making MMFF Sept Issue

JL was running a plastic PI intake recently with a very similar setup to mine...

I am running a 5.0L Big-Bore and here is my build thread

Another Bad *** N/A NPI Modular

My car runs on Shell 91 Octane fuel and shifts at 6500 RPM. I run proper racing wheels and tires, bypass the power steering and remove my sub-box from the trunk as well as the spare tire, jack. I run anywhere between a 1/4 to 1/2 tank of fuel, sometimes less.
I knew he either sold the bullitt or was trying too! Also his converter I beleive. So there were other plans for sure. That bullitt set up hangs about 38# on the nose.

Again, great numbers & times!

Steve
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"There's a bad, built 4.6L Coming in 2016"
Current Elite member of the Halfshaft snapping, Auburn eating, Tranny crunching, Piston Melting, Tire lifting Torque Club

Previous Best 11.75 @ 113.76 1.57 60', ZEX Nitrous April 2012 (346 HP, 503 TQ)
Previous Best 12.94 @ 105.25 1.81 60', Naturally Aspirated April 2012 (254 HP, 315 TQ)

"IN MEMORY OF MY FRIEND JOEL BENDER 1979-2006"
"IN MEMORY OF JOHNNY LANGTON 1975-2011- 4.6L NPI NA RECORD HOLDER"
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post #50 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 03:28 PM
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Also they seemed to have had killer air there that's even hard to get here

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post #51 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 03:31 PM
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Also they seemed to have had killer air there that's even hard to get here

Robert
yep

HRP where we race will have a -1500 to -2000 DA at times.....good freakin air!

will drop your times a couple tenths usually.

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rest in peace JL
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post #52 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TGJ View Post
JL posted what pistons he used, etc...

Congrats MR Langton Making MMFF Sept Issue

JL was running a plastic PI intake recently with a very similar setup to mine...

...My car runs on Shell 91 Octane fuel and shifts at 6500 RPM. I run proper racing wheels and tires, bypass the power steering and remove my sub-box from the trunk as well as the spare tire, jack. I run anywhere between a 1/4 to 1/2 tank of fuel, sometimes less.
Ok, so from your post there by JL, that answers the pistons - "Ross flat-top pistons-stock bore" and the headers - "Kooks headers". We still don't know what gears, but I'm thinking 3.73 or 4.10s.

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post #53 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 06:17 PM
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Yeah, I have always wanted to run at hrp just so I can feel better about my times lol

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post #54 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 06:28 PM
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Ok, so from your post there by JL, that answers the pistons - "Ross flat-top pistons-stock bore" and the headers - "Kooks headers". We still don't know what gears, but I'm thinking 3.73 or 4.10s.
4.30s, IIRC, and 4200 stall (which locked immediately after the 1-2).

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post #55 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 07:08 PM
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4.30s, IIRC, and 4200 stall (which locked immediately after the 1-2).
I know he had at least 4:30's at one point cause he and I were probably the first to use those. He may have had more gear in it later, I don't know.

Steve
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"There's a bad, built 4.6L Coming in 2016"
Current Elite member of the Halfshaft snapping, Auburn eating, Tranny crunching, Piston Melting, Tire lifting Torque Club

Previous Best 11.75 @ 113.76 1.57 60', ZEX Nitrous April 2012 (346 HP, 503 TQ)
Previous Best 12.94 @ 105.25 1.81 60', Naturally Aspirated April 2012 (254 HP, 315 TQ)

"IN MEMORY OF MY FRIEND JOEL BENDER 1979-2006"
"IN MEMORY OF JOHNNY LANGTON 1975-2011- 4.6L NPI NA RECORD HOLDER"
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post #56 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-28-2012, 11:37 PM
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JL had 4.30's...

R.I.P. Johnny Langton (1975 - 2011)

1996 Thunderbird 5.0L 2V-4R70W
12.64 @ 107 MPH -> DA 3315 Ft above Sea level
12.49 @ 109 -> DA 2967 Ft above Sea level
2005 Mustang GT 4.6L 3V-TR3650 - SOLD
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2011 Mustang GT 5.0L 4V-6R80 - Bolt-ons
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post #57 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-30-2012, 09:37 AM
West Virginia Chapter Director /
MA Drag Race Team Coordinator
 
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Hedgesville, WV
Age: 58
Posts: 2,556
Garage
The good part is

Look at the various Naturally aspirated combinations now runnings in the 12's with 2V heads compared to several years ago.

Bored & stroked motors
Stock motors

with PI's unported, NPI's & PI's ported and new TFS style heads.

Pump gas, Race gas and E85

We've come a long way from 1995 with these little motors/big cars!!!!!

Steve
1996 Cougar XR7 Special Edition (Street & Strip)
"There's a bad, built 4.6L Coming in 2016"
Current Elite member of the Halfshaft snapping, Auburn eating, Tranny crunching, Piston Melting, Tire lifting Torque Club

Previous Best 11.75 @ 113.76 1.57 60', ZEX Nitrous April 2012 (346 HP, 503 TQ)
Previous Best 12.94 @ 105.25 1.81 60', Naturally Aspirated April 2012 (254 HP, 315 TQ)

"IN MEMORY OF MY FRIEND JOEL BENDER 1979-2006"
"IN MEMORY OF JOHNNY LANGTON 1975-2011- 4.6L NPI NA RECORD HOLDER"
"IN MEMORY OF MICHAEL VIVERETTE 1953-2013 aka-CHRISTINE KENNEBELL Bird"

Last edited by 1MTNCAT; 11-30-2012 at 05:31 PM.
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post #58 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-30-2012, 01:04 PM
50 years of Mercury Cougar 1967/2017
 
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Cooper City, Fla.
Posts: 1,143
Still tiny engines, look at the times when the humidity is 33%, then goes up
two hours later to 92%. 4 10ths. drop off in the ET.
Thw dew on my roof was running down the back window like it was raining and I was on I95.

Thats what sux about bracket racing, time runs day time, eliminations at night.

Quickest N/A Modular MN12.
11.97@ 109.35
3880 lbs. w/driver.

Bradenton Spring Brake Shootout 03/04/2017.
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post #59 of 154 (permalink) Old 11-30-2012, 02:00 PM
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Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Age: 25
Posts: 2,134
Yep little motors and very big cars. Of course with all these new mustangs and most other cars our boats are a about average now.

I thought it was very impressive that Luke just barely got in the 12s with a stock 2v PI motor and only 3.73 gears!

-Patrick
9.63@77mph on used street tires
See profile for full list of mods

Pics here.. http://forums.tccoa.com/30-videos-images/129479-tbird1997-pictues.html
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post #60 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-01-2012, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
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Location: Jacksonville, NC
Age: 30
Posts: 652
So, fastest N/A 4.6 on 93/104/116 gas goes something like this?

JL with his low 12

Paintme102 with his 12.60(so he says)

me with my 12.76.

Is there a thread somewhere at has all this info in? Maybe we can make a list of all the MN12s times and mods? Just an idea...

97 LX
Motor and trans from 95
Working out the bugs right now.

R.I.P.
1995 Thunderbird LX. Black
BEST MOTOR TIMES
12.76 @ 105
BEST NITROUS
12.12 @ 109 mph
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