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post #61 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-29-2017, 10:51 PM
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Umm ...

You DO know you can compress / swap the spring with the whole assembly off the car, right? In which case, you can use the compressors on both sides, right?

RwP

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post #62 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 12:32 AM
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Originally Posted by ikutoisahobo View Post
Posted a wanted thread for an Addco 1 1/4. But I'll probably end up buying one from SCP.

Note to everyone. The tech article on rear swaybar sizes is correct for the 97 Thunderbird 4.6. .96 inches or 24.5mm. I checked with the digital caliper I bought just a few hours ago. Don't know why all listed rear swaybar bushings for a TBird are ~27mm. Which is way too big, almost worse than having a worn out bushing on there lol

Also a little progress shot. Got the spring and shock in at one side. The old spring was a b**** to take out with even a compressor, I could only get one compressor on anyways since there's no room to put another one and actually tighten it. Putting the Vogtland was easy without a compressor. I reused the isolator, seemed good enough to me. Noticed the rear toe compensator bushing is squuezing out, it's worn out, but looks like a b**** to take out.
1) I don't recall it being hard to pull springs when the car is at full droop (outer UCA bult disconnected as well.
2) You can pop the rear toe comps out with the rest of the suspension in place. I recently did it. You just disconnect the forward bolt on the inner LCA and do a little prying.

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post #63 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 12:40 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RalphP View Post
Umm ...

You DO know you can compress / swap the spring with the whole assembly off the car, right? In which case, you can use the compressors on both sides, right?

RwP
I'm talking about the rear suspension, not the front lol. Sorry, should've been mkre descriptive.


Also, S4Gunn, I didn't unbolt the UCA, didn't even touch it, but I bet that would've helped a crap ton. I might do that on the other side. The toe comps, I think I'll need more detail on those.
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post #64 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 10:41 AM
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Oh, when I swapped out my rear springs, I had to disconnect the LCA at the two INTERIOR-most mounting points to be able to get it out. I'm sure some spring compressors would have helped, but the only kind we have at the the shop is a wall mounted one...had to get creative with the 3rd Arms and the lift.

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post #65 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 11:54 AM
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I don't know what everyone's problem is with the rear springs. Remove the lower knuckle to control arm bolts, disconnect the sway bar end link, then remove the lower shock bolt while supporting the underside of the control arm with a jack. Next lower the jack to release the spring pressure, use one prybar to push down on the control arm while you use another to pry the spring out.

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post #66 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 01:26 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MadMikeyL View Post
I don't know what everyone's problem is with the rear springs. Remove the lower knuckle to control arm bolts, disconnect the sway bar end link, then remove the lower shock bolt while supporting the underside of the control arm with a jack. Next lower the jack to release the spring pressure, use one prybar to push down on the control arm while you use another to pry the spring out.
That was the plan. But that spring is way too big, a compressor was necessary to take it out, even with a compressor we had to do a bit of pulling and pushing.
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post #67 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 01:46 PM
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That was the plan. But that spring is way too big, a compressor was necessary to take it out, even with a compressor we had to do a bit of pulling and pushing.
You didn't loosen the inner bolts (enough).

After loosening the inner bolts (front and rear), if the spring doesn't fall out when you push down on the LCA, you can stomp on it once and the spring will literally just fall out on you.

(Helps that the LCA can pivot up to 75* or so, with the bolts loose.)

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post #68 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 02:39 PM
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+1 I don't even own a spring compressor, never had a problem getting them out. Getting stock height springs IN is another matter but I'd never do that

-Matt
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post #69 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 02:55 PM
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You didn't loosen the inner bolts (enough).

After loosening the inner bolts (front and rear), if the spring doesn't fall out when you push down on the LCA, you can stomp on it once and the spring will literally just fall out on you.

(Helps that the LCA can pivot up to 75* or so, with the bolts loose.)

RwP
Probably a noob question but wont loosening the inner bolts on the LCA throw off the toe and camber in the rear?

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post #70 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 03:38 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RalphP View Post
You didn't loosen the inner bolts (enough).

After loosening the inner bolts (front and rear), if the spring doesn't fall out when you push down on the LCA, you can stomp on it once and the spring will literally just fall out on you.

(Helps that the LCA can pivot up to 75* or so, with the bolts loose.)

RwP
Probably a noob question but wont loosening the inner bolts on the LCA throw off the toe and camber in the rear?
This is what I thought. I was going to get an alignment done anyway but I figured I didn't wanna get myself in that mess. I didn't touch the inner LCA bolts at all.
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post #71 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 03:43 PM Thread Starter
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Also got the Energy Suspension endlinks. They're shorter than the original ones but I figured since my car is sitting lower now that it won't be an issue. But the swaybar kinda scrubs on the parking brake cable assembly. Is that normal, I didn't bother noticing if it did that with the stock links.
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post #72 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 03:50 PM
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That's normal, the cables rub when stock.

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Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote Jr. View Post
Probably a noob question but wont loosening the inner bolts on the LCA throw off the toe and camber in the rear?
Putting in lowering springs will throw off the toe and camber in the rear anyway

But you're half right, camber adjustment is only effected by the UCA inner pivot, which you won't be touching, the LCA inner pivot only adjusts toe. If all you're doing is taking the spring out and putting it back in for whatever reason you should mark the frame and eccentric washer before disassembly and simply line up the marks during retightening to retain alignment.

FWIW I never needed to loosen them when doing springs, I just push down on the arm using my foot

-Matt

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post #73 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 04:13 PM
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camber adjustment is only effected by the UCA inner pivot, which you won't be touching, the LCA inner pivot only adjusts toe.
Oh ok. I have seen what looks like a camber bolt on the rear LCA pivot so I made it a point to to mess with those too much.

Would you happen to know what degree camber the rear has stock? I noticed on my old rear tires that most of the wear was on the inside, and alot of the birds I have seen for sale do the same.

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post #74 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 04:28 PM
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It's a Cam bolt, which isn't short for Camber bolt.

Most alignment places won't perform 4 wheel alignments on these unless you remind them that they're adjustable back there, and your average non-enthusiast owner usually is oblivious to it as well, so as they rack up miles all the wear and tear is never compensated for, ergo irregular rear tire wear. Spring sag or broken springs will result in camber gain, wearing the inside edge.

Problem is, being in New Jersey, like here in Illinois, this is what you may face if you don't mess with it much...



This is also a reason shops sometimes won't do rear alignments on these, if they're seized up after a lifetime of never being touched, they basically need to carefully grind/cut them out, and even after they do you can't get them new, and used from a junkyard from the same locale won't be any better.

Big shoutout to jco1385 for finding me a set

-Matt

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post #75 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 04:59 PM
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It's a Cam bolt, which isn't short for Camber bolt.

Most alignment places won't perform 4 wheel alignments on these unless you remind them that they're adjustable back there, and your average non-enthusiast owner usually is oblivious to it as well, so as they rack up miles all the wear and tear is never compensated for, ergo irregular rear tire wear. Spring sag or broken springs will result in camber gain, wearing the inside edge.

Problem is, being in New Jersey, like here in Illinois, this is what you may face if you don't mess with it much...



This is also a reason shops sometimes won't do rear alignments on these, if they're seized up after a lifetime of never being touched, they basically need to carefully grind/cut them out, and even after they do you can't get them new, and used from a junkyard from the same locale won't be any better.

Big shoutout to jco1385 for finding me a set
Im trying to follow what all these bolts do, solid axle trucks arent this difficult.

So the UCA or the LCA will adjust camber? If just the UCA what exactly does the cam bolt in the rear of LCA adjust?

Lurking
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post #76 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 05:01 PM
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Toe. UCA is camber.
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post #77 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 05:07 PM
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Toe. UCA is camber.
Alright. not trying to sound like a ditz I just haven't messed with that stuff yet.
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post #78 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 08:08 PM Thread Starter
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Looking for swaybar bushings for the stock rear bar, going with the 24.5mm measurement for the diameter.
Should these work? I don't see why not but maybe you guys know better. They're for a Lancer Evo, but seem like it shouldn't be an issue fitting.
http://superpro.suspension.parts/spf2073-24.5k

Let me know what you guys think.
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post #79 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 08:55 PM
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Did you actually measure the sway bar?

Take some twine, wrap it around the bar right by a bushing.

Mark both parts of the twine where it crosses.

Take the twine out, measure the distance between the two marks, divide by 3.14, get the next smallest bushing.

Problem solved.

Also, are the OUTSIDE dimensions compatible with your sway bar brackets? I have no idea if they are or aren't.

RwP

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post #80 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 09:01 PM Thread Starter
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Did you actually measure the sway bar?

Take some twine, wrap it around the bar right by a bushing.

Mark both parts of the twine where it crosses.

Take the twine out, measure the distance between the two marks, divide by 3.14, get the next smallest bushing.

Problem solved.

Also, are the OUTSIDE dimensions compatible with your sway bar brackets? I have no idea if they are or aren't.

RwP
Yeah I stated in an earlier reply that I measured it with a digital caliper. 24.577mm and 0.96 inches which matches up with the tech article. My concern was the outside measurements as well, but from the looks of it, it seems fine. Can't seem to find dimensions for the outside. I could just order them and find out I guess....since it seems like no one actually replaced their rear swaybar bushings but instead went the ADDCO route.
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post #81 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 09:19 PM
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So I've noticed my rear suspension with the Mark VIII aluminum LCA's rides a little lower than the front. Anyone have a link to the correct spring isolator to put in to give it just a 1/4" or so more lift in the rear?

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post #82 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 09:43 PM
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Yeah I stated in an earlier reply that I measured it with a digital caliper. 24.577mm and 0.96 inches which matches up with the tech article. My concern was the outside measurements as well, but from the looks of it, it seems fine. Can't seem to find dimensions for the outside. I could just order them and find out I guess....since it seems like no one actually replaced their rear swaybar bushings but instead went the ADDCO route.
Actually, there were pics of the Energy Suspension units bolted into a MN10/FN12 earlier in the thread.

That, with a bracket to hold the rear nut, is what a lot of people have used.

RwP

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post #83 of 180 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ikutoisahobo View Post
Looking for swaybar bushings for the stock rear bar, going with the 24.5mm measurement for the diameter.
Should these work? I don't see why not but maybe you guys know better. They're for a Lancer Evo, but seem like it shouldn't be an issue fitting.
SuperPro SPF2073-24.5K Rear Sway Bar Bushings - 24.5mm (0.96 inch). SuperPro SPF2073-24.5K

Let me know what you guys think.
These bushings may not fit the brackets, they appear to be both too short and too wide. Just get the Energy suspensions, they're $20

-Matt
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post #84 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 01:06 AM
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Getting a good handle on what I need to do thanks to all of the folks that have posted!!

I do enjoy a fast drive through the curved roads on occasion. 89/95 both will need all new suspension.

Wondering if the factory replacement Tokio adjustable shocks are worth the coin?
Thanks,
Creighton
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post #85 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 01:43 AM Thread Starter
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So I've noticed my rear suspension with the Mark VIII aluminum LCA's rides a little lower than the front. Anyone have a link to the correct spring isolator to put in to give it just a 1/4" or so more lift in the rear?
Everyone is recommending the Prothane 6-1709 for the rear isolator. Two sets needed.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Creighton View Post
Getting a good handle on what I need to do thanks to all of the folks that have posted!!

I do enjoy a fast drive through the curved roads on occasion. 89/95 both will need all new suspension.

Wondering if the factory replacement Tokio adjustable shocks are worth the coin?
Thanks,
Creighton
Some say the ARC Tokico Illuminas are too soft in their comfort setting and they just leave it in the stiff setting. If that's truly the case I'd just get the Tokico HP Blues. I don't think it's worth the coin unless you have an SC and want to retain the feature.
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post #86 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodman View Post
So I've noticed my rear suspension with the Mark VIII aluminum LCA's rides a little lower than the front. Anyone have a link to the correct spring isolator to put in to give it just a 1/4" or so more lift in the rear?
Everyone is recommending the Prothane 6-1709 for the rear isolator. Two sets needed.
This, @Woodman
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post #87 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 12:50 PM
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This, @Woodman
One in the upper perch, one in the lower on each side? Or double them up in the lower perch?

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post #88 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 02:31 PM Thread Starter
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One in the upper perch, one in the lower on each side? Or double them up in the lower perch?
One in the upper and one on the lower. So basically just like the stock isolators, just replace them with these.
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post #89 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 06:04 PM
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One in the upper and one on the lower. So basically just like the stock isolators, just replace them with these.
Thanks!

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post #90 of 180 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 06:11 PM Thread Starter
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Since everyone insisted on the 24mm (15/16") Energy Suspension swaybar bushings, I went ahead and ordered them.

Energy Suspension 9.5160R is what I ordered. I don't know how I'll make that sandwich plate thing that Matt posted, I think some washers would do the trick in between the bushing and the frame as well as on top, don't you think? Also is there any drilling or something involved to get the other bolt in where the notch for the stock bracket would be?

or I could do what S4Gunn did and just use the stock brackets if they work just fine.
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