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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-05-2011, 04:50 PM Thread Starter
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5.0L HO Turbo Build

I'm looking to turbo charge my 5.0L HO with a single turbo. Engine is fairly stock with a few mods such as headers, plugs&wires, port&polished intake. I'm wondering what turbo would be best to use that will spool up quickly and not ruin my engine as this will be my daily driver. Will the stock 5.0L HO handle the power increase and boost? What is the best way to go about this and things I will need? Thanks and all input will be greatly appreciated!
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-05-2011, 06:46 PM
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I'm looking to turbo charge my 5.0L HO with a single turbo. Engine is fairly stock with a few mods such as headers, plugs&wires, port&polished intake. I'm wondering what turbo would be best to use that will spool up quickly and not ruin my engine as this will be my daily driver. Will the stock 5.0L HO handle the power increase and boost? What is the best way to go about this and things I will need? Thanks and all input will be greatly appreciated!

those 5.0 are 8.1 compression .... those motors are good for boost

89 thunderbird twin turbo v6 sc 5 spd
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-05-2011, 06:54 PM
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the stock block will take around 500hp safely and those motors are great for boost...i kno turbonetics makes a great kit for those. go to thier website and you should be able to find what your looking for on there...ive had about 8 5.0s myself and all have been boosted just dont put more then 25lbs of boost on it if u intend on driving it daily for a while or ur gonna be doing head gaskets and maybe even a new bottom end...lol :-)
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-06-2011, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
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Hello......anyone......? Lol
What turbo would be a good choice to use? And I'm planning on only running about 8-10psi so what kind of power gains are realistically expected?

1991 Cougar LS : 5.0L HO Swap, Ported&Polished Intake/Pleanum, E-303 Cam, Ford Racing Dizzy, 9mm Ford Racing Wires, 1.7 Rollers, Crane Rods, EGR Delete, JEGS Equal Length Headers, 2.5" True Duals w/ Super 44 Series Mufflers, Magnaflow Hi-Flo Cats, Custom Cold Air Intake, March U/D Pulley Set, 20" Boss 328 Wheels, 245/35ZR20 BFG, Custom Black Metal Flake Paint, Thunderbird SC Rear Bumper and Sideskirts, Custom Taillights, Clearcorner Lens', Shaved Emblems, Viper 2-way LCD Alarm.

Coming Soon: T64 Turbo System Running 10lbs Boost, 2" Lowering Kit, 42lb Injectors, 255lb/hr Fuel Pump, MSD 6A Ignition, Upgraded/Tuned EEC
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-06-2011, 07:19 PM
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here is a lot of good info on this site ..... they have everything turbo

http://www.theturboforums.com/smf/index.php

this is were i get my info from and i have learned a lot from there and a lot of trile and earro

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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-06-2011, 08:58 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the info ironworker! I'll check out the site. As for the build I will be posting pics shortly within the next couple weeks when I start the process.

1991 Cougar LS : 5.0L HO Swap, Ported&Polished Intake/Pleanum, E-303 Cam, Ford Racing Dizzy, 9mm Ford Racing Wires, 1.7 Rollers, Crane Rods, EGR Delete, JEGS Equal Length Headers, 2.5" True Duals w/ Super 44 Series Mufflers, Magnaflow Hi-Flo Cats, Custom Cold Air Intake, March U/D Pulley Set, 20" Boss 328 Wheels, 245/35ZR20 BFG, Custom Black Metal Flake Paint, Thunderbird SC Rear Bumper and Sideskirts, Custom Taillights, Clearcorner Lens', Shaved Emblems, Viper 2-way LCD Alarm.

Coming Soon: T64 Turbo System Running 10lbs Boost, 2" Lowering Kit, 42lb Injectors, 255lb/hr Fuel Pump, MSD 6A Ignition, Upgraded/Tuned EEC
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-08-2011, 11:39 AM
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the stock block will take around 500hp safely and those motors are great for boost...i kno turbonetics makes a great kit for those. go to thier website and you should be able to find what your looking for on there...ive had about 8 5.0s myself and all have been boosted just dont put more then 25lbs of boost on it if u intend on driving it daily for a while or ur gonna be doing head gaskets and maybe even a new bottom end...lol :-)
Nobody makes a turbo kit for an MN12 with any motor. The closest mustang 5.0 kit is the one for a 94-95 Mustang, but it won't fit without major rework. Space between shock towers on an MN12 is a lot less than on a Mustang. Everyone who has put a turbo on the cars, had to either build it themselves or hire a shop to do a custom build.

Stock 5.0 HO motor isn't going to handle anything close to 24 pounds...more like 10 pounds while crossing your fingers.

David

1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat..................707HP/650TQ

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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-08-2011, 01:35 PM
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those 5.0 are 8.1 compression .... those motors are good for boost
i thought the 87 and up 5.0 HO's all had 9.0:1 comp ratios
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-08-2011, 05:07 PM Thread Starter
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No there isn't a kit for our MN12's that's why I'm building a custom one. The stock 5.0HO block will split in half if your running anything over 20lbs of boost yes. I'm using a T64 turbo and only running a mere 10lbs so I'm not expecting any crazy HP numbers. 425-450 HP will be more than enough to satisfy me and probably enough to get me into some trouble lol. It will be my daily driver so I'm not going to insane, I want to keep my engine in one piece and drive it for a while.

1991 Cougar LS : 5.0L HO Swap, Ported&Polished Intake/Pleanum, E-303 Cam, Ford Racing Dizzy, 9mm Ford Racing Wires, 1.7 Rollers, Crane Rods, EGR Delete, JEGS Equal Length Headers, 2.5" True Duals w/ Super 44 Series Mufflers, Magnaflow Hi-Flo Cats, Custom Cold Air Intake, March U/D Pulley Set, 20" Boss 328 Wheels, 245/35ZR20 BFG, Custom Black Metal Flake Paint, Thunderbird SC Rear Bumper and Sideskirts, Custom Taillights, Clearcorner Lens', Shaved Emblems, Viper 2-way LCD Alarm.

Coming Soon: T64 Turbo System Running 10lbs Boost, 2" Lowering Kit, 42lb Injectors, 255lb/hr Fuel Pump, MSD 6A Ignition, Upgraded/Tuned EEC
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-08-2011, 06:47 PM
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No there isn't a kit for our MN12's that's why I'm building a custom one. The stock 5.0HO block will split in half if your running anything over 20lbs of boost yes. I'm using a T64 turbo and only running a mere 10lbs so I'm not expecting any crazy HP numbers. 425-450 HP will be more than enough to satisfy me and probably enough to get me into some trouble lol. It will be my daily driver so I'm not going to insane, I want to keep my engine in one piece and drive it for a while.

thats what i did made my own

89 thunderbird twin turbo v6 sc 5 spd
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 03:09 AM
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ive had over 20lbs from a blower on a stock 5.0 bottm end from a s-trim vortech charger for over a year before redoing it .030 over... And they do make a kit for 87-93 5.0s for the fox body...never said it was for the tbird...

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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 02:09 PM
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ive had over 20lbs from a blower on a stock 5.0 bottm end from a s-trim vortech charger for over a year before redoing it .030 over... And they do make a kit for 87-93 5.0s for the fox body...never said it was for the tbird...
I know they make kits for 5.0 Mustangs and so do several other companies. Original poster has a 91 Cougar with a 5.0 HO which is not a Fox body..it's an MN12 and the Fox body kit won't even come close to working on his car.

David

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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 06:42 PM
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I know they make kits for 5.0 Mustangs and so do several other companies. Original poster has a 91 Cougar with a 5.0 HO which is not a Fox body..it's an MN12 and the Fox body kit won't even come close to working on his car.

David
never said it would fit once again and never said an mn12 was a foxbody......but it will give him a good idea of what kind of injectors and other parts for it that will tune well and be streetable...he is gonna have to fab parts no matter what he does but the kit for the fox body will give him an idea of what turbo to look for for a DD setup and hp ratings and such...and you say you know they make a kit but in your earlier post you say they dont...you said the closest was for 94-95...
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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2011, 09:57 AM
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never said it would fit once again and never said an mn12 was a foxbody......but it will give him a good idea of what kind of injectors and other parts for it that will tune well and be streetable...he is gonna have to fab parts no matter what he does but the kit for the fox body will give him an idea of what turbo to look for for a DD setup and hp ratings and such...and you say you know they make a kit but in your earlier post you say they dont...you said the closest was for 94-95...
I said they don't make any kits for the MN12 (for any motor), I then said I know they make a kit for 5.0 Mustangs, but none of those will work on his car. I also said the closest kit to fitting on the original poster's car would be for a 94-95 SN95 5.0 Mustang that uses a nearly identical accesory drive arrangment and has the same HO intake manifold as a 91 Cougar with 5.0, not the Fox body kits you are suggesting.

Main differince on the motor is an electric fan on the Mustang instead of belt driven fan on the Cougar. The reason why the Mustang kits won't fit is the chassis. The MN12 is much narrower between the strut/shock towers and obviously the front fenders and bumper area are very differnt.

I investigated this issue in great detail back in 2004 when I decided to build a 93 SC with a 5.0 based motor swap and turbo. Nothing has really changed since then except for some new and better turbos and more options for engine managment systems coming to market.

I based my general layout for the turbo system on the 94-95 Mustang 5.0 kits being manufactured by HP Turbo in New Mexico. The only thing I had to ditch was the smog pump, but I later removed the AC for better engine cooling and weight reduction. I've spent another 6 years making changes and improvements to the motor and the turbo system. I'm still making changes in an effort to perfect the combo.

David

PS: I'm not really interested in arguing with you, just trying to give the original poster some solid information.

1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat..................707HP/650TQ

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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2011, 10:28 PM Thread Starter
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Now now guys lol. It's all good info and I'm fabricating the whole kit myself so I can keep most of my accesorys. I will be removing my a/c and belt driven fan. I'll be using dual electric fans for better cooling as well as an intercooler. Should give me a decent amount of space once that massive belt driven fan is out of there lol

1991 Cougar LS : 5.0L HO Swap, Ported&Polished Intake/Pleanum, E-303 Cam, Ford Racing Dizzy, 9mm Ford Racing Wires, 1.7 Rollers, Crane Rods, EGR Delete, JEGS Equal Length Headers, 2.5" True Duals w/ Super 44 Series Mufflers, Magnaflow Hi-Flo Cats, Custom Cold Air Intake, March U/D Pulley Set, 20" Boss 328 Wheels, 245/35ZR20 BFG, Custom Black Metal Flake Paint, Thunderbird SC Rear Bumper and Sideskirts, Custom Taillights, Clearcorner Lens', Shaved Emblems, Viper 2-way LCD Alarm.

Coming Soon: T64 Turbo System Running 10lbs Boost, 2" Lowering Kit, 42lb Injectors, 255lb/hr Fuel Pump, MSD 6A Ignition, Upgraded/Tuned EEC
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post #16 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-14-2011, 01:40 AM
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I said they don't make any kits for the MN12 (for any motor), I then said I know they make a kit for 5.0 Mustangs, but none of those will work on his car. I also said the closest kit to fitting on the original poster's car would be for a 94-95 SN95 5.0 Mustang that uses a nearly identical accesory drive arrangment and has the same HO intake manifold as a 91 Cougar with 5.0, not the Fox body kits you are suggesting.

Main differince on the motor is an electric fan on the Mustang instead of belt driven fan on the Cougar. The reason why the Mustang kits won't fit is the chassis. The MN12 is much narrower between the strut/shock towers and obviously the front fenders and bumper area are very differnt.

I investigated this issue in great detail back in 2004 when I decided to build a 93 SC with a 5.0 based motor swap and turbo. Nothing has really changed since then except for some new and better turbos and more options for engine managment systems coming to market.

I based my general layout for the turbo system on the 94-95 Mustang 5.0 kits being manufactured by HP Turbo in New Mexico. The only thing I had to ditch was the smog pump, but I later removed the AC for better engine cooling and weight reduction. I've spent another 6 years making changes and improvements to the motor and the turbo system. I'm still making changes in an effort to perfect the combo.

David

PS: I'm not really interested in arguing with you, just trying to give the original poster some solid information.
No hard feeling david im not trying to argue either i think it was just a misunderstanding and happens... Anyway im also looking into building a turbo setup for a 96/97 and am in the process of finding the right car to start off with. If you have any links to pipe kits u may have used or what your setup consist of now i would appreciate it(injector #,TB,manifold setup,oil feed). From all the info i gathered so far i know im in for a challenge but thats kinda the point to doing a tbird and not another foxbody that a million other people have done. sorry if i came off agressive just a passionate ford guy...lol



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post #17 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-15-2011, 02:21 PM
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No hard feeling david im not trying to argue either i think it was just a misunderstanding and happens... Anyway im also looking into building a turbo setup for a 96/97 and am in the process of finding the right car to start off with. If you have any links to pipe kits u may have used or what your setup consist of now i would appreciate it(injector #,TB,manifold setup,oil feed). From all the info i gathered so far i know im in for a challenge but thats kinda the point to doing a tbird and not another foxbody that a million other people have done. sorry if i came off agressive just a passionate ford guy...lol
No hard feelings here either. This link has a rather lengthly list of mods and numerous pictures that may answer some of your questions.

http://www.sccoa.com/forums/garage_v..._vehicle&id=39

My turbo system was custom built around a 5.0 based race motor. The 5.0 based pushrod motor has alot more space to work with than what you are planning because the motor is not nearly as wide as the 4.6. Mine is already a tight fit, and yours will be much worse if doing a conventional turbo layout mounted near the front of the motor with forward facing exhaust manifolds or headers. You could actually drop a 351 based 427 in the car and still have more room than with the 4.6 motor.

Turbo and fuel system sizing will be based on your HP goals and intended use of the car. Mine was built with a goal of 1000 HP at the crank, and everything was sized accordingly or bigger.

Let me know if you have any questions, and I'll do my best to answer then or direct you to a place to get the answers.

David

1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat..................707HP/650TQ
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post #18 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-15-2011, 10:50 PM
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No hard feelings here either. This link has a rather lengthly list of mods and numerous pictures that may answer some of your questions.

http://www.sccoa.com/forums/garage_v..._vehicle&id=39

My turbo system was custom built around a 5.0 based race motor. The 5.0 based pushrod motor has alot more space to work with than what you are planning because the motor is not nearly as wide as the 4.6. Mine is already a tight fit, and yours will be much worse if doing a conventional turbo layout mounted near the front of the motor with forward facing exhaust manifolds or headers. You could actually drop a 351 based 427 in the car and still have more room than with the 4.6 motor.

Turbo and fuel system sizing will be based on your HP goals and intended use of the car. Mine was built with a goal of 1000 HP at the crank, and everything was sized accordingly or bigger.

Let me know if you have any questions, and I'll do my best to answer then or direct you to a place to get the answers.

David
thanks bro aprreciate it...i built a couple supercharged 5.0 last being a 306 with a s trim based off a dss level 10 block but wanted to get away from the blower because its just way to much maintanence. u think i would be better off going with a 94/95 model instead of the 96/97? and what ecu do u run with ur setup being that you started with a sc v6 and converted to the 347?im very familiar with the small blocks but not the MOD motors and know what your saying is true they are super wide and im not to fond of the OHC design...my goal HP would probly be around 1000HP or more like yours since i already have a really clean 94 sc and another car being a lincoln Ls for my DD.im looking for a track car that still could be streetable to go to shows but not DD material...thanks for the link i will definitely check it out when i get a sec and thanks for the info!!




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post #19 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-17-2011, 09:37 AM
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thanks bro aprreciate it...i built a couple supercharged 5.0 last being a 306 with a s trim based off a dss level 10 block but wanted to get away from the blower because its just way to much maintanence. u think i would be better off going with a 94/95 model instead of the 96/97? and what ecu do u run with ur setup being that you started with a sc v6 and converted to the 347?im very familiar with the small blocks but not the MOD motors and know what your saying is true they are super wide and im not to fond of the OHC design...my goal HP would probly be around 1000HP or more like yours since i already have a really clean 94 sc and another car being a lincoln Ls for my DD.im looking for a track car that still could be streetable to go to shows but not DD material...thanks for the link i will definitely check it out when i get a sec and thanks for the info!!

I don't think it matters which model year car you use, if you are planning a switch to a 302 or 351 based motor.

At first i tried using the stock 91 LX 5.0 T-bird wiring harness and ECU and later switched to a 94-95 Mustang ECU with a blow through MAF and SCT tuning. It was easy to tune for WOT full power or for part throttle and driveability, BUT NOT BOTH mainly because MAF range and resolution issues. Using a new slotted MAF with a blow through confguration would be much better, but that wasn't an option when I built the car.

After a couple years of fighting the tune, I gave up and went to a standalone engine managment system (FAST XFI). It required a new harness and converting to GM sensors, a 3 bar MAP, and full time wide band o2 sensor, but the car is now very tuneable and has ran great ever since installing it.

Something you need to be thinking about before you go much further is what transmission you intend to use. You need something really built up to handle 1000 HP. I went with an AOD because I didn't want the hassel of trying to control the transmission with computer and knew I could buy a built AOD from Lentech that would bolt right into the 93 SC I used as a foundation. This also allowed me to keep overdrive for highway cruising. I eventually ended up switching to a full manual VB so I could have a trans brake for better track performance. Last year I broke the transmission and had Alan at Dirtydog completly rebuild and upgrade it for additional strength and switched to a looser much stronger converter for better performance at the track.

If you want brute strength and no computer to fuss with, a TH400 is the way to go. Unfortunately it doesn't have OD. You could use it with a Gear Vendor Overdrive, but it would be pretty expensive.

David

1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat..................707HP/650TQ
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post #20 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-18-2011, 06:37 PM
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I don't think it matters which model year car you use, if you are planning a switch to a 302 or 351 based motor.

At first i tried using the stock 91 LX 5.0 T-bird wiring harness and ECU and later switched to a 94-95 Mustang ECU with a blow through MAF and SCT tuning. It was easy to tune for WOT full power or for part throttle and driveability, BUT NOT BOTH mainly because MAF range and resolution issues. Using a new slotted MAF with a blow through confguration would be much better, but that wasn't an option when I built the car.

After a couple years of fighting the tune, I gave up and went to a standalone engine managment system (FAST XFI). It required a new harness and converting to GM sensors, a 3 bar MAP, and full time wide band o2 sensor, but the car is now very tuneable and has ran great ever since installing it.

Something you need to be thinking about before you go much further is what transmission you intend to use. You need something really built up to handle 1000 HP. I went with an AOD because I didn't want the hassel of trying to control the transmission with computer and knew I could buy a built AOD from Lentech that would bolt right into the 93 SC I used as a foundation. This also allowed me to keep overdrive for highway cruising. I eventually ended up switching to a full manual VB so I could have a trans brake for better track performance. Last year I broke the transmission and had Alan at Dirtydog completly rebuild and upgrade it for additional strength and switched to a looser much stronger converter for better performance at the track.

If you want brute strength and no computer to fuss with, a TH400 is the way to go. Unfortunately it doesn't have OD. You could use it with a Gear Vendor Overdrive, but it would be pretty expensive.

David
haha wow ill have to save that to my computer i was thinkin a th400 because i planned on using a brake since it will be my track car only i have a clean 94sc for a cruizer...and where would i find the management system u talked about? my goal is no less then 10's...i kno its not gonna be easy but ive already been there with a few other cars all being mustangs and its honestly just bolting things on and getting a tune with them...thanks for the info im looking into the car im gonna start with now and hope by september to be started my build



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post #21 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-19-2011, 01:43 PM
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Danny,

You can buy the Fast XFI standalone at numerous places. I got mine from the Race Shop who did the installation of the standalone system. Which is the same place who has redone most of the turbo system, tunes the car and built the stainless exhaust systems for both of my SCs. Here's is a link to the shop. The owner's name is Dan Saitz.

http://www.hyperformanceracing.com/

David

The other popular standalone engine managment system (GM based) is called "Big Stuff 3" and Dan call also supply it.

1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat..................707HP/650TQ

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post #22 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-20-2011, 10:35 PM
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thanks alot dave i really apreciate it. i think im ordering my long block next week so i start with something blueprinted either that or im gonna go part by part....im a licensed pa tech for emissions and inspections nd have built all myn other blocks but was thinkin of getting a shop to do thisone since im gonna shoot alot of boost through it...idk yet but thanks for taking the time to help me out!!!



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post #23 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-21-2011, 12:22 PM
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thanks alot dave i really apreciate it. i think im ordering my long block next week so i start with something blueprinted either that or im gonna go part by part....im a licensed pa tech for emissions and inspections nd have built all myn other blocks but was thinkin of getting a shop to do thisone since im gonna shoot alot of boost through it...idk yet but thanks for taking the time to help me out!!!
Danny,

If you want a super strong foundation that is professionally assembled, Dart Machinery is now offering short blocks based on numerous blocks they offer.

http://www.dartheads.com/products/sh...k-builder.html

For a 302 based motor you would use the 8.2" deck Iron Eagle or Sportsman block (I got the stronger Iron Eagle version which is overkill). I imagine you can have it built in numerous configurations like 302, 331, 347 and 363 CID. Suggest dished pistons and not going any higher than 9.00:1 static compression. Then you just need to select the cam, heads, valvetrain, intake, timing set ect... The most important portion of the engine build happens when building the short block. Most of the other stuff, is just bolted together.

David

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post #24 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-21-2011, 07:10 PM
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Danny,

If you want a super strong foundation that is professionally assembled, Dart Machinery is now offering short blocks based on numerous blocks they offer.

http://www.dartheads.com/products/sh...k-builder.html

For a 302 based motor you would use the 8.2" deck Iron Eagle or Sportsman block (I got the stronger Iron Eagle version which is overkill). I imagine you can have it built in numerous configurations like 302, 331, 347 and 363 CID. Suggest dished pistons and not going any higher than 9.00:1 static compression. Then you just need to select the cam, heads, valvetrain, intake, timing set ect... The most important portion of the engine build happens when building the short block. Most of the other stuff, is just bolted together.

David
i didnt even think of dart...hahaha ill check it out now thanks bro



Danny
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post #25 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-26-2011, 02:22 PM
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I'm looking to turbo charge my 5.0L HO with a single turbo. Engine is fairly stock with a few mods such as headers, plugs&wires, port&polished intake. I'm wondering what turbo would be best to use that will spool up quickly and not ruin my engine as this will be my daily driver. Will the stock 5.0L HO handle the power increase and boost? What is the best way to go about this and things I will need? Thanks and all input will be greatly appreciated!
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post #26 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-28-2011, 08:56 AM
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i thought the 87 and up 5.0 HO's all had 9.0:1 comp ratios
Correct. Actually, in '86, the 5.0 HO motor had 9.2:1 compression with the new '86 heads but was lowered to 9.0:1 in '87 when they switched to the E7 heads. An '85 HO motor would be good for forced induction, they have a compression ratio of only 8.4:1.

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post #27 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-29-2011, 12:13 AM
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As far as the OD goes, you will not really need it if you go with a 400 or a glide. Since you will no doubt step down to a 3.27 gear to make the engine work to build boost. Typically, you will see the turbo cars with lower (numerically) gears for that reason.

SWS

Soon to have some MHS parts, cams, 'luminum block, lower compression, ported heads, autorotor, and need to make long tubes. I have almost all the stuff and need some #42-50s a bypass valve, and maybe a few other things.
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