Gen II Mark VIII + J-Mod + 3.73’s - Upper Spring vs Traction Control - TCCoA Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
Gen II Mark VIII + J-Mod + 3.73’s - Upper Spring vs Traction Control

I have a quick question for you guys that have the Gen II Mark VIII's and have done the J-Mod and/or 3.73's and left out the lower spring.

If you left out the spring, when it barks the 1 - 2 shift at WOT, does it trigger the traction control?

I'm finally getting around to do the J-Mod and I’m debating on whether to keep the spring or not.

edited: I had it backwards as to which spring to leave out. Per Darrin: You want to take out the lower spring and keep the top spring

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine

Last edited by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L; 09-23-2008 at 02:49 PM.
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 12:20 PM
Seasoned PostWhore

Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Age: 36
Posts: 7,430
Garage
Send a message via AIM to MadMikeyL
Yes it does trigger the traction control, but the shift feel is so nice, and the look on someones face when your lincoln gets sideways at 50+mph is just priceless. I just turn the traction control off as soon as I get in the car all the time.

-91 Cougar LS, coming soon, complete overhaul with a 427" Windsor.
-90 XR7 5-speed black on black w/sunroof, MP2, coated rotors, double intercooler, 15%OD, ported heads, comp stage 1 cam, 85mm TB, 90MM LMAF, 80# injectors, and ported big valve heads
-98 Mark VIII LSC, Procharger P600b, TR3650 swap and 3.73s.
-90 SC Automatic rustbucket winter beater
-97 Tbird Sport 4.6 Nice weather daily driver
-"Your buddy Mike is INSANE!" -ClintD's dad
MadMikeyL is offline  
post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 01:42 PM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
That is what I figured. I like leaving the traction control on (just personal preference).

I really don’t like the soft shifts with the spring installed, but I also don’t want to be hitting the traction control if I do an impromptu WOT run.

I wish there was an "in the middle" spring....

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 02:51 PM
Seasoned PostWhore

Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Age: 36
Posts: 7,430
Garage
Send a message via AIM to MadMikeyL
Well I can tell you that with 3.27s it turns on the traction control light, but on dry pavement it doesn't really affect acceleration at all. Its not like it all of a sudden locks your back brakes up or anything. 3.73s wouldn't help that matter though. I have gotten quite quick at turning off traction control though, to the point where I can reach over and turn it off in less time than it takes to wind out first gear, so if you do floor it, you can reach over and turn TC off before it shifts into 2nd.

-91 Cougar LS, coming soon, complete overhaul with a 427" Windsor.
-90 XR7 5-speed black on black w/sunroof, MP2, coated rotors, double intercooler, 15%OD, ported heads, comp stage 1 cam, 85mm TB, 90MM LMAF, 80# injectors, and ported big valve heads
-98 Mark VIII LSC, Procharger P600b, TR3650 swap and 3.73s.
-90 SC Automatic rustbucket winter beater
-97 Tbird Sport 4.6 Nice weather daily driver
-"Your buddy Mike is INSANE!" -ClintD's dad
MadMikeyL is offline  
post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 03:05 PM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMikeyL View Post
Well I can tell you that with 3.27s it turns on the traction control light, but on dry pavement it doesn't really affect acceleration at all. It’s not like it all of a sudden locks your back brakes up or anything. 3.73s wouldn't help that matter though. I have gotten quite quick at turning off traction control though, to the point where I can reach over and turn it off in less time than it takes to wind out first gear, so if you do floor it, you can reach over and turn TC off before it shifts into 2nd.
What I don't like is the 10 - 15 degrees of ignition timing it removes as long as the "spinning wheel" light is lit (I love that icon! For some reason it just cracks me up!!).

I know at the drag strip it costs about 2 seconds when compared with the traction control disabled! With it on, it barked them off the line when I floored it, the light came on and it ran right at 17 seconds…

It’s the first option under the “vehicle options”, right? If so, I may just do like you said and practice turning it off before it hits second.

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-17-2008, 03:15 PM
Seasoned PostWhore

Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Age: 36
Posts: 7,430
Garage
Send a message via AIM to MadMikeyL
Yes, its the first option so its just a matter of hitting "vehicle settings" then "reset", so in the 5 or so seconds it takes to wind out first gear, you should be able to reach over and hit the 2 buttons fast enough to turn it off before its an issue.

-91 Cougar LS, coming soon, complete overhaul with a 427" Windsor.
-90 XR7 5-speed black on black w/sunroof, MP2, coated rotors, double intercooler, 15%OD, ported heads, comp stage 1 cam, 85mm TB, 90MM LMAF, 80# injectors, and ported big valve heads
-98 Mark VIII LSC, Procharger P600b, TR3650 swap and 3.73s.
-90 SC Automatic rustbucket winter beater
-97 Tbird Sport 4.6 Nice weather daily driver
-"Your buddy Mike is INSANE!" -ClintD's dad
MadMikeyL is offline  
post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-27-2008, 11:54 AM
Veteran Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Houston Clear Lake
Age: 54
Posts: 704
Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L View Post
What I don't like is the 10 - 15 degrees of ignition timing it removes as long as the "spinning wheel" light is lit (I love that icon! For some reason it just cracks me up!!).
Then I bet you really hate the 12-20 degree's of "tip in retard" that is in the factory programming.

it pulls timing any time you "tip into the gas", be it from a "dead stop" or when you are cruising down the road at 50MPH.

Ford Factory TIP IN RETARD..FTL!!!

looking at the first gen mark 8 it's got 20 degrees of Tip in retard
and the second gens have 12 degrees of retard

retarded..aint it?

1995 Lincoln Mark VIII "Grandmas Car"
400,480 miles *STOLEN 04-13-08*

98 Mark VIII LSC

STONE
STOCK
SLOW

NO
MODS
HERE
XLRVIII is offline  
post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:58 PM
No, Mr. Lemmywinks, No!!!

Moderator
 
Grog6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Harriman, TN
Age: 56
Posts: 10,039
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by XLRVIII View Post
it pulls timing any time you "tip into the gas", be it from a "dead stop" or when you are cruising down the road at 50MPH.

retarded..aint it?
So is this if you ease into it vs stomp it?

Both my cars act differently in those two situations...

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, Most Outrageous Diversion by MSNBC for this quote
Grog6 is offline  
post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-01-2008, 09:00 AM
Veteran Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Houston Clear Lake
Age: 54
Posts: 704
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grog6 View Post
So is this if you ease into it vs stomp it?

Both my cars act differently in those two situations...
"tip in" is "tip in" regardless of the "rate of tip in"...

1995 Lincoln Mark VIII "Grandmas Car"
400,480 miles *STOLEN 04-13-08*

98 Mark VIII LSC

STONE
STOCK
SLOW

NO
MODS
HERE
XLRVIII is offline  
post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-08-2008, 11:59 PM
4th Gear Poster
 
40th Chicken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: The Twip, MI
Posts: 275
what does "tip in" mean? is that too much fuel vs air??

95 LX 40TH Anniversary, BLUE over grey.

BLUE strobes under each front seat. BLUE all around the driver including the 97 cupholder. 800W Pioneer Amp, 1300 Sony Explode Sub, But it all comes down to my kick AZZ floor model head unit.

So Yes, it's Still STOCK for now

Quote:
Welcome to AMERICA.............now learn to speak English!
40th Chicken is offline  
post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 02:06 AM
Newbie
Moderator
 
master486's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: San Diego
Age: 32
Posts: 5,650
"Tip in" is when the throttle opens after being completely closed.

--Chris

DirtyDog Torque Converter For Sale!!
Huge Parts Sale!!

1996 Thunderbird LX
Awaiting some tender deconstruction...
master486 is offline  
post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 06:06 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
Quote:
Originally Posted by master486 View Post
"Tip in" is when the throttle opens after being completely closed.
Is it only after the throttle has been closed or is it also if the throttle hasn't moved very much for a certain time? For example you've been cruising at 1/4 throttle for a while and then you add another 1/2 throttle (3/4 throttle total) to accelerate. Isn't that also considered tip in?

Just asking. I always thought tip in was anytime there was a large change in the TPS signal. (I'm talking theory here, not specific to our EEC's tuning)

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 10:10 AM
Veteran Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Houston Clear Lake
Age: 54
Posts: 704
Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L View Post
example you've been cruising at 1/4 throttle for a while and then you add another 1/2 throttle (3/4 throttle total) to accelerate. Isn't that also considered tip in?

Just asking. I always thought tip in was anytime there was a large change in the TPS signal. (I'm talking theory here, not specific to our EEC's tuning
That is correct, Tip in is tip in... from a dead stop or a roll, a sudden change in throttle angle is "tip in".. and the retarded timing occurs.

I can watch it do it in the datalog, it sucks.

Tip in also comes into play during the shifts, that is how they "soften up the shifts"....just killing the tip in retard firmed and quickened the shifts by a fairly large margin... and it made the throttle response MUCH better as well.
No more "spongy non responsive" gas pedal!!!

1995 Lincoln Mark VIII "Grandmas Car"
400,480 miles *STOLEN 04-13-08*

98 Mark VIII LSC

STONE
STOCK
SLOW

NO
MODS
HERE
XLRVIII is offline  
post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 10:13 AM
Veteran Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Houston Clear Lake
Age: 54
Posts: 704
Quote:
Originally Posted by master486 View Post
"Tip in" is when the throttle opens after being completely closed.
datalog the car and post the file...

get up to 40MPH and punch the gas pedal and watch your spark value PLUMMET.
"tip in retard"...you've got PRP, have you removed the tip in retard?

1995 Lincoln Mark VIII "Grandmas Car"
400,480 miles *STOLEN 04-13-08*

98 Mark VIII LSC

STONE
STOCK
SLOW

NO
MODS
HERE
XLRVIII is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the TCCoA Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome