95 4rw70 in a 98 Mustang? - TCCoA Forums
 
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-09-2004, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
 
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95 4rw70 in a 98 Mustang?

Fellas...To The mountain top....

Enlightened Ones...

Oh Tranny Gurus....


I beseech you, may i take my 95 4rw70 out of my 3.8 Tbird NA and place it in my new 98 3.8 N/A Mustang..... whose tranny is old, weak, and not rebuilt like the tbird's. For I cannot tell of what transmission my mustang has.



Hommina Hommmina Hommmina......mmmmmmm.
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-09-2004, 07:30 PM
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98+ 4R70W's are pretty strong. Without knowing exactly how the 95 was rebuilt, I'd have to advise against this."If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

96 Mustang GT 5spd. w/ 248A Option (GTS). Stock for now until I get the Roush on.

97 Thunderbird 4.6L LX /w Sport Package
24k B&M Cooler, 1" lowered, Steeda UD Pulleys, Dynomax cat-back, J-mod, 3.73's, PI intake, PI cams, 03 GT MAF/Tube, SCT tuned - Gone but not forgotten.
MAMN12 Drag Racing Team [email protected] In need of updated times.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-12-2004, 11:28 PM Thread Starter
 
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it was done by the most reputable shop around here...shifted beautifully on the bird. firm shifts. clean.


anyways, i get a clunk like feel when i put it into gear and start to go. Im sure the rebuilt one is in better shape than the one in the 95. It only had 5 driving days of use after it was rebuilt lol


still no answer to the question tho.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-14-2004, 12:42 PM Thread Starter
 
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ttt
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-16-2004, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
 
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am i asking the holy grail question or something lol???


where is jimmy hoffa too?
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-16-2004, 03:33 PM
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I'm still not convinced it's a good idea, but sure you could do it. It depends on the quality of the build as to whether its any better.

96 Mustang GT 5spd. w/ 248A Option (GTS). Stock for now until I get the Roush on.

97 Thunderbird 4.6L LX /w Sport Package
24k B&M Cooler, 1" lowered, Steeda UD Pulleys, Dynomax cat-back, J-mod, 3.73's, PI intake, PI cams, 03 GT MAF/Tube, SCT tuned - Gone but not forgotten.
MAMN12 Drag Racing Team [email protected] In need of updated times.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-16-2004, 07:18 PM
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Well I would venture to say that the wiring is different. The connector on the '95 trans is probably different, pinouts I mean.
there were some materials updates done by '98 so if all you got was a wear parts rebuild without any valve body work, I would be leary.

Check the article it describes the differences between years.

rm
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-17-2004, 12:14 AM Thread Starter
 
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i had every solenoid, every servo, plate etc. the only god **** thing they didnt replace was the valve body lol
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-17-2004, 12:23 AM Thread Starter
 
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Ok here's what I see..



Gear ratios, the 4R70W has the wide ratio gears whereas the AOD-E doesn't.

4R70W ratios are: (1st) 2.84, (2nd) 1.55, (3rd) 1.00, (OD) .7
AODE ratios are: (1st) 2.40, (2nd) 1.40, (3rd) 1.00, (OD) .67


The 4R70W has a larger diameter slip yoke on the driveshaft.

The 4R70W has a differennt extension housing.

The 4R70W uses better output shaft material

The 3.8, 4.2 and 5.0 all use the same case.

In 96, the alignment pins for the main control changed diameter.

Now I need some special kit? Whats that all about??? to install a smaller pin main control?

I have to use a 98 MLPS?
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-17-2004, 08:47 AM
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From the thesis

Main Transmission Connector
Beginning with the 1998 model year, a different pin arrangement was used in the main connector on the transmission (the one at the passenger side rear). Even though the connector is the same, and you can plug them in, you cannot put a 1998 and beyond transmission in a 1997 and prior vehicle (or vice versa) without re-arranging all the pins in the connector, the transmission will NOT shift.

Manual Lever Position Sensor (M.L.P.S.)
There also was a change to the sensor on the driver’s side of the transmission that senses where you have put the gear selector. All 1997 and beyond Mark 8’s and all 4R70W’s starting in 1998 went to a totally different sensor. They do not interchange. You must keep the sensor that your car came with if you are thinking of swapping in a newer transmission.

Intermediate One Way Clutch Symptom?
No 1-2 shift or no 3rd and 4th gear. A failing one way clutch will cause a late 1-2 shift that finishes with a big bang, or will allow the engine to run into the rev limiter at WOT.
What Models?
All AODE and 4R70W’s built before 1998 model year. (Some of the later years, like 1996 and 1997 were better, but not bullet proof).
Problem?
This design one-way clutch is not suited for this environment.
Solution?
Install the mechanical diode one-way clutch. This part is almost bullet proof.

As far as friction material goes in the direct clutch, you want to stick with the production material that was introduced in the 1998 model year. This is a higher energy material that can withstand a lot of power and torque. Also, when this material was introduced in production, the steel separator plates in the clutch were made thicker, .067” to .077”. A thicker steel plate will provide more heat sink than a thinner plate. You may be better off just buying a new direct clutch assembly that is already assembled.


This is the little shaft that connects the forward clutch cylinder to the direct clutch cylinder. There have been two different stub shafts made in production. You want to use the current shaft; this went into production starting in 1998. Looking at the groove where the splines on the small end, end, you can identify this shaft. The early shafts used a groove cut in at the end of the splines; the current shafts have a taper rather than a groove. The shaft with the taper is much stronger than the shaft with the groove, the shaft with the groove tends to break at the groove.




I think there is enough here to tell you that unless you fixed your Bird trans with these things, don't do it.
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-17-2004, 12:18 PM Thread Starter
 
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Agreed. I will check soon as I get home and look at the work order.


So any insight on the main control pin problem?

And does anyone have the pinout change layout?
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-17-2004, 08:57 PM
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The connector is easy to repin. You just need the list. there is a little kit that was sent with my trans from Jerry when he was still at Ford that the tech used to redo the connector.
Unfortunately I don't have that.


good luck
rm
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-18-2004, 01:29 PM
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my article in wip forum goes over the pinouts.

96 Mustang GT 5spd. w/ 248A Option (GTS). Stock for now until I get the Roush on.

97 Thunderbird 4.6L LX /w Sport Package
24k B&M Cooler, 1" lowered, Steeda UD Pulleys, Dynomax cat-back, J-mod, 3.73's, PI intake, PI cams, 03 GT MAF/Tube, SCT tuned - Gone but not forgotten.
MAMN12 Drag Racing Team [email protected] In need of updated times.
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-22-2004, 09:40 PM Thread Starter
 
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blonde moment...whats wip forum?
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-22-2004, 10:39 PM
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http://forums.tccoa.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=37

96 Mustang GT 5spd. w/ 248A Option (GTS). Stock for now until I get the Roush on.

97 Thunderbird 4.6L LX /w Sport Package
24k B&M Cooler, 1" lowered, Steeda UD Pulleys, Dynomax cat-back, J-mod, 3.73's, PI intake, PI cams, 03 GT MAF/Tube, SCT tuned - Gone but not forgotten.
MAMN12 Drag Racing Team [email protected] In need of updated times.
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post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-23-2004, 10:48 PM Thread Starter
 
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ok...so what about swapping over at least the torque converter and flexplate from the 98 MK VIII? That mod went pretty well on the tbird.
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post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-24-2004, 04:45 AM
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The swap is pretty straight forward, no biggie

96 Mustang GT 5spd. w/ 248A Option (GTS). Stock for now until I get the Roush on.

97 Thunderbird 4.6L LX /w Sport Package
24k B&M Cooler, 1" lowered, Steeda UD Pulleys, Dynomax cat-back, J-mod, 3.73's, PI intake, PI cams, 03 GT MAF/Tube, SCT tuned - Gone but not forgotten.
MAMN12 Drag Racing Team [email protected] In need of updated times.
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post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-25-2004, 10:22 AM
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RobinCali,

How do you like that Mark8 TC? Have my 97 and was thinking of doing that, but havent really heard enough about it though. I am not looking for the almighty launch, but just something to help it wind up a tad more before hand. Let me know how that is working out for you. Changing DS and IRS this weekend anyhow and since I will have it that far apart the TC shouldnt be an issue.

Honor, Grace, and Dignity.....Do you remember these?
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post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-25-2004, 10:34 PM Thread Starter
 
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as thomas said once...

its up there on the seat-o-pants meter. Gives you a heavy foot too heheh
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