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post #1 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 07:51 PM Thread Starter
 
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Will This Work For Shudder?

What do you think of this?

http://drivetrain.com/autotranscontr...0SHUDDER%20FIX

If it works, it sure would help a lot of people.
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post #2 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 08:50 PM
 
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Thats awesome. Anyone ever try it?
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post #3 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 08:53 PM
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My personal opinion, with $98, I could switch to Mercon V, and add a trans. cooler. That would probably take care of the shudder on it's own. If it's too far gone, I would think that no matter what, if the TC is shot, it's shot, and nothing will fix it short of replacing the TC. You could prob. even get a Mark VIII flexplate/converter for close to that if you look, and that is even better. Just my opinion tho... I would save for a new trans before buying that. I don't like band-aids.



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post #4 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 09:27 PM
 
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I wouldnt buy it either, but its cool.
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post #5 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 10:07 PM
 
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What they said ^

-Dave
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post #6 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 10:18 PM
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It looks like a $100 delay box to me. Just something else to get screwed up and cause problems. I'm sure a tuner can do anything that box does. By no means does it improve the stock components it just delays lockup. Try this it works on all pre 98 valvebodies.

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post #7 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 10:27 PM
 
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Dirtydog, you never cease to amaze us all, I have learned so much from your posts and e-mails.
Thanks for teaching us all your secrets!

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post #8 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 10:59 PM Thread Starter
 
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The reason I asked is I have switched to mercon V, and put in a large cooler. It stopped the shudder for about 3,000 miles. It is a very light shudder, just as it goes into 3rd gear under very light throttle. Under heavy throttle, or once it is locked, the TC won't shudder. If I manual shift it and get the rpm's up before lockup, it will not shutter.

The transmission works fine. It's just the TC shudder, and low rpm trans shift points under light throttle.

It acts like it tries to lock up too early without enough lockup force. That is why I wondered if you could change the lockup rpm's and shorten the time it takes to engage the lockup, if it would help. I hoped it might keep me from having to drop the trans just yet.

The car only has 81,000 miles, which I know is about the life of a TC in a 95. I drive it easy, and don't race, or spin the tires. I very seldom even have the throttle to the floor.

The truth be told, I want it to last a year or two more, with as little money and effort as possible. I would gladly spend $100.00 and drop the pan to give me a couple of years more use.
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post #9 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 11:08 PM
 
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Exact same problem I had, do the valve body plate mod above or the whole J-Mod!
It will be gone!
It will not cure a bad TC though, replacement is the only total cure.
I have not replaced my TC yet and since I did the mod I am VERY pleased with my 2-3 shift.

-Dave

BTW: it wont cost $100 bucks either!
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post #10 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-09-2004, 11:19 PM
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even i jmodded my tranny and put on marauder tc still have low speed shudder until sct tune flash then shudder is gone.

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post #11 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-10-2004, 02:56 AM
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There are two things that will fix TC shudder:

Mercon V fluid swap/trans cooler.

TC swap (advised only to be done with cooler and Mercon V as above).

A chip can help maximize live of the TC (esp in 94-5s) but all in all it boils down to the above.

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post #12 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-10-2004, 09:48 PM
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If you have the early design lockup piston( in the converter) nothing will fix it except a new converter. They just weren't strong enough to work. Don't forget about the other variables. Bad plugs, wires or a faulty egr can cause a shudder feeling and ruin the converter clutch over time.
The 99 up valvebody is the only way I know of to get a really good lockup flow. The 98's are better than the drilling I posted, but that drilling is a 30-40% improvement over stock. It's pretty easy to tell if that modification will help. If it won't help the holes are already bigger than what you are drilling them. If you leave the cotter pin out of hole C you will get a very aggressive heavy throttle unlock. I personally like that, but grandpa doesn't.
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post #13 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-10-2004, 10:52 PM
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garbage run away fast. I would do the J mod and install A large transmission cooler. I also recomend changing the fluid every 25000 miles. A custom programed chip will also help from sct.
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post #14 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 09:29 AM
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you can have your TC lock up schedule changed with a chip.

also, I have a question about this exact topic(mostly for Alan)

I have a new 98 tranny(slightly used). it has a JMOD, and some other goodies.
I also installed a 1300 mile old Mach 1 TC.

I completely flushed all the lines, and cooler. COMPLETELY!

mercon V, Hayden 26k cooler, Mach 1 TC, and new TCC solenoid, with this tranny.

here's my deal:

my old 94 tranny had the exact problem since I owned it, and after JMOD/Mercon V/cooler added in.

the TC locks way too early. it shifts through 1-2-3 just fine, but as early as 30 mph, the TC locks up, drawing the RPMS way down. It feels exactly like driving a manual tranny at 30 mph, and you slip it into 4th gear. The motor bogs, unless you kick it down into second, or tap the brake pedal slightly to unlock the TC.

I am considering having my ECU reflashed, or buying a chip with a custom lock-up schedule. My 97 had this exact problem severely, so our chip now locks the TC at 42 mph, instead of the FACTORY-SET 34 mph.

anayone have thoughts on this? it happens with a cold, or warm tranny...almost 90% of the time. if you drive it like a hot-rod(more throttle around town) you never see it. But if you are in traffic, or on a 30mph steet, it drops the rpms in 3rd(O/D off) down to 1100, which barely moves the car.

This ISNT the notorious shudder. But it does suck! I was looking more forward to having that problem go away with my new tranny, than I was having it be a "better" tranny than my 94. I'm bummed.

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post #15 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 09:34 AM
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Reflashing the pcm is the only way you're going to correct that. The transmission doesn't know when to do what so it lets the computer tell it what to do. I think it's called marriage. :P
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post #16 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 10:10 AM
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Thats actually good news Alan. Thanks(for the 400th time)

I'll probably get my chip, and have a few different things done.

in your opinion, what is the highest MPH you would consider "safe" for a TC to stay unlocked, before it builds too much heat?

My buddy's chip keeps the TC unlocked until 52 mph... he does alot of around town driving, and his TC lock-up was alot like mine. He got so sick of it, he had his chip burned to "slip" longer.

Thanks
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post #17 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 11:42 AM
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The bogging got a lot better with 3.73s - the car will shift into 4th and lockup the TC around 30mph, but the extra gear really makes the car wake up. It also eliminated downshifting on the highway... I just slowly lean on the pedal and the MPH climbs up nicely.

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post #18 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 11:46 AM
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Ditto here. 3.73's prevent you from running those low rpm's and will stop that problem. He has a markVIII and I would go 4.10 on it. I just installed 3.73's in one and It didn't respond as nicely to 3.73's as my Tbird did.
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post #19 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 12:12 PM
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And I was also surprised the 3.73s didn't really hurt the gas mileage, as long as you are driving close to the speed limit. 22-25 MPG highway isnt bad. Go 85mph and it would probably drop a bit more than it would with 3.27s, but that's expected.

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post #20 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 03:47 PM
 
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This electronic board does work. I have it in a J-modded 94 mark viii tranny that I believe was rebuilt. I put in a new from ford 98 mark viii converter and the shudder started up about 800-1000 miles after install. Threw in some Dr. Tranny's shudder fix and the shudder problem went away. While I was investigating the shudder problem I read about this electronic board and found one of these on ebay for $15 so I grabbed it up (I would not have paid $100 that is redicoulous). I installed it while I was bored at work one day (remember the shudder problem was already gone) The electronic board did help the overdrive shift it seemed quicker. It also now shifts into overdrive at a higher speed. I think this would fix blackIce's problem but it is for the older wiring 4r70w's. I don't know if it would fix a shudder problem but it did help the shift schedule is what I am trying to say... This was in a 94 Mark VIII by the way...

-Joe
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post #21 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-11-2004, 03:52 PM
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So you're saying it's a delay box and it delays.
Sure it works because the transmission doesn't lock up so early. Thats kind of like telling the doctor "it hurts when I do this" while bending your elbow , and then the doctor says
"don't do that" Besides you could have probably put your car back together with a cooler,new fluid, and a good converter and the problem would have dissappeared anyway.
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post #22 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 12:35 AM
 
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I do have a tranny cooler The B&M Supercooler 24,000GVW from summit. The fluid was completely drained did the Jmod at the same time. When the shudder first started 800-1000 miles later I changed the fluid again, yes it was mercon V from ford. Again the torque converter was brand new from ford for a 98 mark viii it was the f8lz-????-BARM if I remember right I could dig up the receipt. I am not advocating this product, I would not spend $100 for it (I bought it on ebay for $15). Just telling my experience with it. It did not fix the shudder it was fixed before I put it in. I do like the way it shifts with it in there. I would have ordered a converter from you dirtydog but you weren't posting on here at the time I installed my new motor and tranny. At the time everyone said to get the 98 mark viii converter it was supposed to be the best... Would you recommend taking this board back out Alan? It has been it there for about 20,000 miles and the shudder has not returned.

Last edited by biggyzzz; 12-12-2004 at 12:43 AM.
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post #23 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 08:35 AM
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I would leave it in until it causes problems, but as I said it just seems like something else to screw up to me. I honestly doubt the box itself fixed your problem. Which you said as well.

Blackicelsc, to answer your question that I overlooked. I want lockup to come on around 50mph in general. The factory seemed to like 37mph which was a little too early IMO.
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post #24 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 10:48 AM
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Well while everyone else is asking questions...
Starting about 2 months ago, it felt a though my trans was sliping, not all the time, just sometimes at low speed. After a couple weeks it began to get worse, doing this more frequently and also at wot it would seem like when I hit the power band, none of the power was getting to the wheels and Iwould barely accelerate. Wll another week goes by and this is happening all the time and getting more violent. This progressively got worse and worse, and now the car shakes violently at random times, any speed from 5-70mph, mostly around gear shifts but as I said is now shuddering randomly at up to 70 mph. Needless to say it is a very scary feeling, and heaven forbid if I ever had to accelerate quickly... but anyways, is this the classic shudder ? I have found a couple trans, one from a 01 gt and one from a 03 gt both low miles, and a shop to do the swap. However, my father doesnt think its the transmission, and thinks its electrical. i want this to stop asap, so I want a new tran, tc, and j-mod. My father keeps finding a friend of a friend that he wants me to take it to but this always falls through. I think he just wants it done his way, even though im picking up the tab. I have called several shops and all have quoted me 1200-1600 for a rebuild and install, accept one that will do the swap for 200 + 50/hr for any wiring. What should I do ? Im about to make a withdrawl and get it fixed without their knowledge. Is it safe to drive ?
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post #25 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 10:50 AM
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I'd check the plug wires and egr first. The torque converter cannot shudder in 1st gear.
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post #26 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 10:55 AM
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it doesnt, my fault, that is supposed to be 15-70, first is fine under normal driving, second is sometimes shudder free if im at like no throttle, usually starts around 2-3 shift and up from there... sorry
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post #27 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by dirtyd0g


Blackicelsc, to answer your question that I overlooked. I want lockup to come on around 50mph in general. The factory seemed to like 37mph which was a little too early IMO.
Alan

Thanks Alan. thats about where I would want it to fully lock as well. With a cooler, and Mercon V, the extra heat generated by TC slip wont/shouldnt be a problem.

thanks for coming back to answer that. I appreciate it.
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post #28 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 11:02 AM
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I still think if you haven't installed new plug wires(and plugs) you should. That was the problem that destroyed the converter clutch in my car. I'd hate to see you put a new converter in and still have the shudder, an engine miss will feel like a shudder.
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post #29 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 11:05 AM
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alright will do ... if thats all it is thatd be great... and itll give me a little time to save up and do that swap right. though this "shudder" is more like a violent shake at times. should i go with colder plugs or just swap for oem until i find the problem ?
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post #30 of 46 (permalink) Old 12-12-2004, 11:44 AM
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also, why does it feel like i hit the brakes when coasting to a stop around 35 mph ?
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