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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 10:52 AM Thread Starter
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What does yours shift at?

4.6L Thunderbirds and Cougars with stock transmissions.

Mine is a 95 and in drive it will upshift into 2nd at 4700rpm. If I manually shift it later I feel more power up at 5200rpm.
Problem is when manually shifting I feel a lack of acceleration just before it upshifts. It's definately not the rpm limiter because if I shift too late I feel the rpm limiter and it smacks the party down like hitting a wall.

There is none of this mentioned funny business from 2nd to 3rd.
3rd to 4rth, never done it. I'm at my speed limiter in 3rd.

I'd like a solid upshift at 5200rpm. What rpm is it supposed to shift at in drive?

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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 03:45 PM
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And the answer is....
It depends
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 05:53 PM
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The problem is manually shifting these transmission is a bad idea. They were not designed for it, the mnual holds are just assistance when driving on slippery conditions.
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 06:01 PM
 
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I have a feeling mine is going to become slippery all the time, lol!
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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 06:01 PM
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My car used to shift into 2nd at 5500 rpm's... I think it is mostly due to the tune.
Get an SCT chip, it will really help out with that "lost" power.

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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 08:21 PM
 
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my car is all stock and shifts right at 5200 rpm.
post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected]
my car is all stock and shifts right at 5200 rpm.
Mine is the same way.Ever since the PI motor it will occasionally bounce the rev limiter in the 1-2 shift.It is definitly shifting way too early.

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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 09:13 PM
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Don't know, I tend to keep my eyes on the road when accelerating hard...

From what I recall, it used to shift from second to third (5k+ rpm) a bit later than 1-2 (below 5k rpm).
But nowadays I don't floor it anymore, because I think I'm gonna need Darrin soon...


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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 09:21 PM
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stock?? man its been soooo long ago, but mine shifted 1-2 @ 5000 and 2-3 at 5000

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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 09:49 PM
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You people need a tune to fix your shift points. Lonnie or I can help you with that.
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post #11 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirtyd0g
The problem is manually shifting these transmission is a bad idea. They were not designed for it, the mnual holds are just assistance when driving on slippery conditions.
Alan
how about the C6's?

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post #12 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrin
You people need a tune to fix your shift points. Lonnie or I can help you with that.
Darrin
Well as soon as i can afford you or Lonnie ill have it tuned

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post #13 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-20-2006, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _95badbird
how about the C6's?

c6 is hydraulically controlled even still it wasn't designed for manual shifting however a shift kit can easily fix that. Short of going to a full manual valvebody the 4r70w will never work right with the electronics. The full manual valvebody doesn't use them.
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post #14 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirtyd0g
c6 is hydraulically controlled even still it wasn't designed for manual shifting however a shift kit can easily fix that. Short of going to a full manual valvebody the 4r70w will never work right with the electronics. The full manual valvebody doesn't use them.
Alan
well, would a shift kit or a manual valve body be better?

On my C6, I don't run a kickdown.
I manually shift it.
If I didn't, it would shift at like 4500 or so.....not enough.

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post #15 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 08:53 AM
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iF you are dealing with a race car I'd say the manual valvebody for the street I'd say a shift kit.
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post #16 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 09:08 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirtyd0g
The problem is manually shifting these transmission is a bad idea. They were not designed for it, the mnual holds are just assistance when driving on slippery conditions.
Alan
I prefer not to manually shift. I want 5200rpm in D, hence the thread.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlover007
My car used to shift into 2nd at 5500 rpm's... I think it is mostly due to the tune.
Get an SCT chip, it will really help out with that "lost" power.
I'm assuming your combination is not stock because a 5500rpm upshift in my car will just leave me smacking the limiter. Please tell more about this SCT chip.


Mustangman and 95xbird. You cars are doing what I expect mine to be doing. 5200rpm in D. So if yours are stock, something must be wrong or not calibrated correctly with mine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrin
You people need a tune to fix your shift points. Lonnie or I can help you with that.
Darrin
Why do I need a custom tune if some members claim they reach 5200rpm without modifications?

I'm all ears Darrin. Whats the first step towards 5200rpm upshifts into 2nd. I have 51 or 5200rpm into 3rd.

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post #17 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 10:17 AM
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Mine stock was 5200 1-2 WOT shift, now with the tune from Lonnie it is 5500. It is fast enough of a shift that it doesn't hit the rev limiter. I have a stock 12 inch converter and stock 3.27 gears.

It feels like that is too high, but the car is faster, I no longer get the neck snapping 1-2 shift I got from doing the mild JMod with all springs, I just get belt squeel now.

I wish I had time to put in a better converter to bump that, and after a recent meet I found out that someone with 3.73 was only running 2700 rpm at 75 mph. My car doesn't need to cruise at over 55 generally, my 89 does 2400 rpm at 75, I though it would be a bigger change.

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post #18 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 12:32 PM
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5 grand 1-2 shift, 2-3 shift 5200 here, dunno bout 3-4 havent tried it yet.

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post #19 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Whats the first step towards 5200rpm upshifts into 2nd. I have 51 or 5200rpm into 3rd.
what tach are you looking at? the stock one? cause thats about as accurate as tossing a dart at a dartboard and hitting the wall.

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post #20 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-21-2006, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfsram
Mustangman and 95xbird. You cars are doing what I expect mine to be doing. 5200rpm in D. So if yours are stock, something must be wrong or not calibrated correctly with mine.
Why does it have to be something wrong???I have a complete new drive train in my car and none of it is stock.As far as the 5200 RPM bounce limiter problem, it is only because it has a PI motor which i might ad revs a whole lot faster than the stock anchor i had in there before.I whould say the engine revs too fast before the transmission can tell it to shift at WOT.

I need a tune because i have to correct the shift points for the new motor.
Still think something is wrong???

Edit:When it had the stock motor in it it only reved to about 4700 at WOT.

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Its slow, Really.
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post #21 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-22-2006, 12:28 PM
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get rid of the rev limiter ,.my 96 v8 was tuned by eecdoc and now i shift wot at 6k rpm into every gear ,i still have a stock bottom end and on top of that i have run a good 70 passes down the 1/4 on a 100 shot.contrary to what has been stated in the past the rev limiter will hurt the engine more than running it without one

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post #22 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-22-2006, 12:53 PM
 
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I assume you not talking about just popping it into nuetral and slapping the pedal to the floor, I would think a rev limiter would do far less damage then letting an engine over rev with abandon?

How does fords method of rev-limiting the 4.6 damage the engine when it kicks in?
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post #23 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-22-2006, 07:03 PM
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You don't want to rev a 12 inch TC over 5400 (5500?) RPM.

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post #24 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 08:48 AM Thread Starter
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I don't see why an inaccurate tach has anything to do with this.

In D it's shifting way too early into 2nd. Way before the rev limiter. I've manually shifted it just before the limiter and it's faster. I want that ALL the time, not just when manually shifting.

Even if the tach is inaccurate. Say it's 10% off. It shifts way before the limiter into 2nd but shifts just before it into 3rd. I want the into 2nd the same rpm as it's into 3rd.

95xbird, something is wrong because I'm not happy. I expect 5200rpm into 2nd and 5200rpm into 3rd while WOT in D. My car does not do this into 2nd, only into 3rd.

I feel like I'm repeating myself.

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post #25 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 09:37 AM
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Every mn12 shifts like that bone stock.Just the way ford made it.Doesnt mean there is something wrong.Take the extra money and have it tuned if your not happy with it.If ford made the car any better from the factory it whould be competing with the mustang.

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Its slow, Really.
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post #26 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 10:20 AM
 
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Quote:
95xbird, something is wrong because I'm not happy. I expect 5200rpm into 2nd and 5200rpm into 3rd while WOT in D. My car does not do this into 2nd, only into 3rd.
Oh, your one of *those* customers.

Nevermind it's working exactly as it was designed and like every other one out there on the road.

It isn't your car that there is something wrong with, it's perfectly fine. Mines stock and 1-2nd shifts are right about 4700 at WOT. Your the one with the issue.

Quote:
In D it's shifting way too early into 2nd. Way before the rev limiter. I've manually shifted it just before the limiter and it's faster. I want that ALL the time, not just when manually shifting.
It's shifting into 2nd exactly where it was programmed to by Ford, in your opinion that's way to early... So pay up and get your shift points tuned the way you like them.

Last edited by Southpaw; 07-23-2006 at 12:12 PM.
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post #27 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfsram
I don't see why an inaccurate tach has anything to do with this.

It has everything to do with this. If it doesn't read your engine's RPMs correctly, it makes you think it's shifting at the wrong time.

EVEN if it's actually shifting at 4700(?) or wherever you say it's shifting at....there is no way for us to tell you a way to make it shift at 5200 without manually doing it. And manually shifting it is a bad idea. There is no secret button to push, or a secret install (BESIDES A TUNE) that can make it shift at 5200, safely.

If you feel you've been repeating yourself, it's because you need to just take this advice:

If you're not happy with your MN-12's shifting, the only way to safely make it shift when you want, is to get that tune.

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post #28 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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Six people that responded to my thread get 5200rpm upshift. Yes I'm the one with the issue. I like things to be correct.

A torquey motor wouldn't mind being shifted early but leaving 500rpm behind in a stock 4.6L is costing me about 2 tenths.

So I get the picture, some get 5200rpm. Lucky few.
The rest of us didn't and you advise I need a tune to correct it.

Oh and competing with the Mustang? That's funny. The MN12 surpasses the Mustang is many ways but not in acceleration.

My 88 Mustang LX 5spd ran 13.9 @ 99 Clutch in, throttle closed @ 5000rpm. It was a bone stock high mile 5L that I'm confident would not have dipped into the 13's shifting 500rpm early.

A 70 Road Runner that I used to have ran 11.54 @ 118 with an automatic 440. It shifted into 2nd and into 3rd @ 6000rpm. Take 500rpm away from it and it would still run it's numbers.

So what's it take to get the tune? Do I need a new computer, reflash mine, who does it and how much?

Thanks

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94 LHS 3.5L 15.8 @ 88, wife's car
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post #29 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 07:08 PM
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mn12 doesnt surpass the mustang in the performance area at all.your car is stock deal with the fact that it is slow and it shifts at 4700. the thunderbird doesnt measure to the mustang unless it is in the ride.face it you drive an old man car so it is up to you to make it turn heads.and that all cost alot of $.

04 PI swap,SVO Supercharger 8-9 psi,Alcohol injection,39lbs Cobra injectors,XCal2-Walbro 255 LPH fuel pump,4.10 T-Lok,2003 4R70W built to withstand by RobertP,450hp JMOD,3800 circleD stall,trucool 4739 Trans Cooler,Dynotech 3.5 Driveshaft,70mm T/B,SCP Cold Air Intake,90mm LMAF,JBA headers,Magnaflow Midmount,No cats with 3inch piping,Vogtland 1.6inch drop,Cobra R's and xenon body kit.

Its slow, Really.
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Last edited by 95xbird; 07-23-2006 at 09:17 PM.
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post #30 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95xbird
mn12 doesnt surpass the mustang in the performance area at all.your car is stock deal with the fact that it is slow and it shifts at 4700. the thunderbird doesnt measure to the mustang unless it is in the ride.face it you drive an old man car so it is up to you to make it turn heads.and that all cost alot of $.

theese cars can look good, they can go fast.... but stock, they dont look that good and theyre not fast.
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