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post #1 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 08:39 PM Thread Starter
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Turntable suggestions

The Dual turntable that I've had for years is beyond done. Looking for a replacement and was just wondering what people like.

This is for my component set up, won't be tied into the computer, don't need Bluetooth or any of that shit. Don't want to spend a ton of money either but do like features, like tone arm return.

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #2 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 09:13 PM
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Dual is not a bad turntable.

I used to run a shop, so new is likely to be worse than what you have, unless you want to plug into a USB port.

The first thing to do, is pull the platter, and see what's under it.

There's usually a clip at the center; remove that, and pull up gently while rotating it; the belt will fall off, the idler will disengage, whichever is there.

It will be belt drive, or Idler drive.

If it's belt drive, I'd keep it, and refurb it.

If it's idler drive, that's less good, but if you've been happy this far, it's probably fine.


In either case, the problem is going to be rubber, or worst case, motors.


I just rebuilt my Technics SL-B3, it's belt drive, 22.4" , and the new motor was $20.

I was listening to "Concrete Blonde" this morning on it.


Take the platter off, and post pix; I'll help.

Also, what kind of cartrige does it have?




I do know good sources for parts, needles, etc.

I don't have any recommendations for new ones, tho.


I'm wrong, my source for parts has turntables, too:

https://www.newark.com/search?st=turntable%20parts

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


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Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

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post #3 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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I took the platter off earlier this afternoon and the belt looked good.

The original problem was with the Dual, when you move the tone arm over towards the platter the unit starts. It stopped doing that, the power wasn't coming on. Motor?

I had someone look at (or so I thought) and he said he couldn't figure it out, I doubt he even looked at it. I noticed today at the bottom of the base there's 2 buttons to raise and lower the tone arm and one of them looks like something in the base for them broke.

I really haven't paid much attention to it until recently and wouldn't mind getting it back up and running. There's an Ortofon cartridge on it now. It's been years since it last worked.

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #4 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Rodeo Joe View Post
I took the platter off earlier this afternoon and the belt looked good.

The original problem was with the Dual, when you move the tone arm over towards the platter the unit starts. It stopped doing that, the power wasn't coming on. Motor?

I had someone look at (or so I thought) and he said he couldn't figure it out, I doubt he even looked at it. I noticed today at the bottom of the base there's 2 buttons to raise and lower the tone arm and one of them looks like something in the base for them broke.

I really haven't paid much attention to it until recently and wouldn't mind getting it back up and running. There's an Ortofon cartridge on it now. It's been years since it last worked.

Joe
OK, there's a switch, usually a limit switch with a lever, that does the power.

But, everything you are describing sounds lubrication related.

The belt will have to be replaced; If you'll list the model #, I'll see what it needs.

When a motor goes bad, it gets what's called "WOW", as in wow and flutter. Old terms, lol.

Wow is like a cruise control going faster, then slower, then faster... "hunting" is another word for it; it's due to the bearings being wasted. if there's no play in the shaft, from sise to side at any angle, it's fine and needs lube.


You likely have a bad switch; A working of the contacts, and a drop of contact cleaner will probably fix the switch; they have silver bearing contacts, so they'll be tarnished.


This thread is harder without pix, lol.



The motor can be relubed , the preferred one was "Phonolube": GC ELECTRONICS 10-1223 GC Electronics Phonolube.

Also use that on the turntable platter bearings.

You can wash out the old grease with WD40, but relube it immediately.

The tonearm bearings get graphite, Very Carefully, lol.

A new belt and a new needle is all it needs, other than that.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

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post #5 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 09:59 PM Thread Starter
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Greg,

It's a CS 508, apparently there were 2 versions of this. One with a black chassis and one with a silver plastic chassis, I have the silver one. I'll try to get pictures up tomorrow, it's a belt drive. Once I get the platter off, where abouts am I taking the pictures?

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #6 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-13-2018, 10:19 PM
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Don't worry about it, that's all I needed.

I've fixed dozens of these.

Here's a video off YT, it's everything you need.

I love the internet; I was working with Matt on his amp last night, this is fun, actually.


EDit: do not use 3in1 oil on anything other than a sewing machine; use phonolube, or white lithium grease.

You really need to do all the pivots, not just the switch.

91% alcohol, make sure it dries before you lube.

Other than the 3in1 oil, this guy is pretty good.

My boss wbw would have used 3in1 if I let him, lol.
Marvel mystery oil is way better, but neither are really good here.

This is a slightly different version, but yours should look the same underneath.

he notices it's slow, but it's lube related, and blows it off.

To make a strobe light for one without it, all you need is a tiny neon lamp to shine on the strobe disk.

If it's important, I can send you a circuit drawing with how to use an led.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

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post #7 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 05:23 AM Thread Starter
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Lol Greg, I used a video from the same guy earlier in the day to take care of something on my receiver!

As you mentioned, mine is a bit different. The turntable doesn't sit in a base like the one in the video does, that one also has an arm to raise and lower the tone arm. Mine has buttons on the the base and they appear loose. It looks like I have to remove a cover from the bottom. There's probably about 10 screws there, I don't want to just start taking screws out in case something is being held on by it!

I'll take some pictures and get them up for you.

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #8 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 06:26 AM
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I found a comment under a video that helped me fix my 3 monitors, after a power outage; I would probably have never fixed it otherwise.

C223 didn't look damaged, but.

I also learned something new; electrolytic caps won't work for long on 1.8V, it's not enough voltage to keep the 'electrolytic' part good.


The buttons on the front that do the tonearm are a release for a cam, iirc, and the linkage is going to be loose, bent, or broke.

You push the button, it releases, and does the action as the cam comes around.


Lube everything first, because if something's stuck, it will break worse.

The little shaft that lifts the arm needs to be free, and easily movable.

All the little flat steel pieces are delicate, so be gentle.

It seems to me, (it's been years) if you stuff both buttons hard on something when you're moving it, it pops a clip off, and it will be laying in there somewhere, so put a white towel down, and flip it over. The towel makes the parts easy to find.

Seems like the outermost button is the one that comes off.

The only other thing I remember fixing on those was the cartrige mount; don't strip the screw, and don't break anything. It's likely unobtanium.

Oh, and the rear RCA plugs are kinda cheesy, and the outer ring can get loose. it will hum if it does that.
I've seen one come in with the outer ring missing, and it won't work like that. They were still in his cable, as he found when he tried to plug it up.

Unless the bearings/bushings are bad, that turntable is way better than any you'll find today.

That motor was probably $30 then, it'd be $200 today. So no one uses those, lol.

Lube, and reassembly is probably all it needs, and replace any belts; some of those had a toothed belt to switch the changer part, yours may or may not.

I don't think so, but.


Newark apparently bought MCM electronics, and you can get a wide range of parts there.

CEI used to sell belts and other ttble stuff, but IDK now.

My Technics ttble has a single button to operate it, but it doesn't have as good of a motor as the dual.

Seems like: if your tonearm is square, and this grainy looking silver metal, then it's beryllium metal, and is really lightweight.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote
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post #9 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 07:11 AM Thread Starter
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Thank you sir, a lot of info there!

After I checked out the video you posted, I did a search and found one with my turntable.


The one in the video is the same one I have. You can see the 2 buttons on the right front of the base that I've mentioned. Towards the end of the video he shows how he took the bottom of the unit off, so that will help me out a lot. He said his had a bad switch that was replaced. I don't hear anything rolling around so hopefully nothing broke in there. He flips it over onto the tonearm!

I won't get to this until later today, ton of yard work to get done.

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #10 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 06:44 PM Thread Starter
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It is alive!

Got the yard work done, enough of that!

Opened the bottom of it to check things out. Nothing broken and no loose parts rolling around. But there were a few things going on with this.

I find the pieces with the spring for the on/off switch like in the video. I flip it back and forth and see it doesn't make full contact with the switch, so maybe this is problem. I plug it in and motor works! I take those pieces off, clean the shaft with the alcohol and put the white lithium on it. Getting the clip and the spring back on was a pain the ass, the eyes aren't what they used to be.

Get it together, plug it back in and start moving the tonearm and nothing happens. I double check all the arms underneath to see if anything else had fallen off. The back of the tonearm seemed really loose and noticed that it had popped out to where it was supposed to be secured. I used a small screwdriver and got it back in. When the tonearm swings it rides over on top of a pin and engages everything. After I got that done I tried it and it works!

I still need to get a new belt and a cartridge for it, probably clean up whatever old lube might be still in there. I put the white lithium on anything that looked like it had been factory lubed. Greg, that Phonolube doesn't seem to exist, is there something else besides the white lithium?

The buttons in the front have a plastic piece that I guess was glued to the base and they slide back and forth in it. The plastic piece popped off so I need to super glue it to resecure it.

Thank you for all you help!

Joe
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Turntable 004 (1024x768).jpg (262.9 KB, 1 views)
File Type: jpg Turntable 007 (1024x768).jpg (378.8 KB, 0 views)
File Type: jpg Turntable 009.JPG (4.13 MB, 1 views)
File Type: jpg Turntable 016.JPG (4.09 MB, 1 views)
File Type: jpg Turntable 017.JPG (4.36 MB, 1 views)
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It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #11 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 08:05 PM
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That's a nice looking turntable; it looks a lot like mine, same vintage, I bet.

I like being able to put a record on, close the lid, and push a button to start it.

Cartridges are available; I'm not sure which one fits that. There's a standard mount, and a P-mount, among others.

I'm rocking a 70's vintage Shure M91E; one of the first things I did when I ran the electronics shop in the 80's was to buy a box of good styli, now Long gone.

You can still buy cartridges and needles, But I'd see what's on there.

Again, it may be better than you can get now.

I'm happy you got it fixed!!

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


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Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote
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post #12 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 09:02 PM Thread Starter
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I'm happy you got it fixed!!
Couldn't have done it without you!

Should I leave it with the white lithium?

Joe

It's not a 97 Sport, it just looks like one!

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post #13 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-14-2018, 09:30 PM
No, Mr. Lemmywinks, No!!!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodeo Joe View Post
Couldn't have done it without you!

Should I leave it with the white lithium?

Joe
I'm looking for the other stuff; I haven't found it yet.


EDIT: This is it; last tube I has was metal, but.

https://www.amazon.com/GC-ELECTRONIC.../dp/B001DPM2NO

Lithium will work fine, but you'll need to redo it in a year or so.
The other stuff is like a light bearing grease; Timken or Kendall bearing grease is too stiff, I've tried both.



I'm trying to find belts for my cassette deck; I found why it doesn't work, the belt that pulls the heads up is slipping, and the tape counter belt is black goo.



I guess it's been ~10 years since I've played it, lol.

Turntableneedles.com had all three belts I need for deck and ttble for less than $10 shipped.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

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post #14 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 12:03 PM
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This is a fascinating thread, guys. I'm not into music myself. While i find it hilarious that some of you guys keep rooms of old PCs up and running to play vintage games (instead of using emulation), I totally get the desire to refurb an old turntable (just like refurbing a vintage car that has been surpassed by almost every metric by a modern camry). Some tech cannot be totally supplanted by modern systems.


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post #15 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 01:43 PM
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I'm one of those idiots that, once I buy something, I wring every last bit out before it hit's the trash.



I made new bronze capstan bushings for this cassette deck, about 20 years ago.

It was the first thing I bought with a Real Job.

Second was an Alpine tape deck, lol.

~1984, I guess.


Quote:
Originally Posted by S4gunn View Post
...While i find it hilarious that some of you guys keep rooms of old PCs up and running to play vintage games (instead of using emulation), ...Some tech cannot be totally supplanted by modern systems.


-g
My fast twitch muscle response can feel the difference in the keyboard interface and mouse interface between win98, WinXP, XP64, and Win7; those are listed in decreasing thruput.

I use keyboards that are n-key rollover, because I may be hitting several keys at once; I was severely disappointed to find my Model M has a masking problem, in that I couldn't run, jump, and throw a grenade at the same time.
Got that shit fixed real fast, lol.

Emulation leads to a completely disjointed feel, unless you're playing MAME games, like marble madness, lol.

DOOM is probably the best game for later windows, but it's interface is so slow that I find myself mentally stacking commands, so it loses a lot of the immediacy of an FPS. Ultra-Nightmare mode makes it worth it, tho.

I rarely see what kills me, lol. You just suddenly get thrown across the level into a wall, or crunched, or...


Q2 was probably the last really fast game; the interfaces have slowed since then.

Guys like us are why they don't let KB and mouse guys play with console guys, unless the consoles get auto-aim.

We spent most of the 00's jumping into servers, and killing everyone until they banned us for cheating; if you're NOT cheating, that's a firm Win, in my book.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

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post #16 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 02:33 PM
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A lot of greases don't mix, so be sure you have all of the old cleaned off first. Also, using any petroleum product on plastics is not advisable. Better safe than sorry.

One product we used on VCR cam gears and such back in the day is black molybdenum, which factories used. I know moly is generally lithium derived, but this stuff is not petro based and was marketed specifically for use in these mechanisms. I still have about half a tub of this specialty lube — it's relatively thin and I apply it via precision applicator (small syringe with flex extender tube).

Silicone grease is safe for plastics; it's readily available and cheap. You don't need 100% for these applications. This adheres well, is thin enough, and is inexpensive: https://www.homedepot.com/p/DANCO-0-...8693/203193536

For electrical contacts (switches, relays, etc.), you need to be concerned about conductivity and voltage breakdown. If you use silicone in these areas, it should be 100%. Please, no DeoxIT recommendations; I'm not a believer.

You can use just about anything on metal-to-metal, of course. Most bearing greases are gonna be too thick for low torque consumer electronics applications. Garden-variety white lithium grease cakes up over time.
GC Phonolube #10-1223 is mineral oil based. Some people use GC Lubriplate #10-2302, which is white lithium. Unfortunately, they've both been discontinued and are pretty much Unobtainium now. GC's replacement lithium grease is #19-2302, but I think it's discontinued as well (although it still shows on their current PDF). I don't think there's an exact equivalent to Phonolube.
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post #17 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 06:15 PM Thread Starter
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I've been doing a lot of poking around since Greg gave me the help I needed to get this back up and running.

The thing I've been looking for mostly is the proper lubricants I'll need to keep this performing as it should. Unfortunately a lot of what was used isn't available anymore. I've seen posts from people using motor oil and all kinds of snake oil treatments. Someone did mention this and they have an oil also. I can't find the thread that I got this info from, more searching! But proper cleaning the old lubricants off seems to be the key to get everything working as it should after new lubricants are applied.

I also found a site dedicated to just turntables, Vinyl Engine. They have all kinds of info including PDFs with owners manuals and service manuals, they have mine! There's a forum there also, really haven't gone through everything, I had to go to work.

Joe

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post #18 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 06:44 PM
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Yep, VE is a good resource. I've nabbed some lit from them.

Super Lube typically must be mail ordered from HD, so not readily available like the Danco, at least in my area. As most people on this forum know, most auto stores carry silicone dielectric grease, which is just as good on plastics.

I haven't used Super Lube, but I know it's popular. It's supposedly food-safe, too, but I use this for when I need food-grade (it has no PTFE, unlike Super Lube). Just personal preference...
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post #19 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 06:48 PM
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You can eat teflon; it passes thru unchanged, lol.

The biggest tragedy of the 90's was the elimination of FreonTF solvent; it was a marginal greenhouse gas, but would not destroy anything.

I accidentally sprayed some in my eye; all it did was boil off, looking really weird as it did so.

You do that with modern solvents, you're going to the hospital.

Acetone hurts almost as much as mercon V in your eye.

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Torque,

My Home Depot has that Danco, so I can use it on the places I need to lubricate? Sorry for the questions, but I don't want to mess anything up here.

Joe

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post #21 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-15-2018, 10:08 PM
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Something I'll mention; when you get done, run it for an hour, and look at the strobe. if the lamps out, grab an incandescent or florescent lanp, and hold it near, you'll see the pattern on the strobe.

Set the speed, and walk away for another hour.

See if it's changed; it should sill be locked perfectly.

If it's not, you're not done. Some bearing surface is not right, you can usually feel a warm spot where the friction is.

Add lube, and do another hour.

If it never goes stable, there's a more serious problem to deal with, either motor or bearing/bushings.

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
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Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


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post #22 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 01:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodeo Joe View Post
My Home Depot has that Danco, so I can use it on the places I need to lubricate? Sorry for the questions, but I don't want to mess anything up here.
I personally only use the silicone stuff on plastics, because I like to play it safe, and its compatible with most plastics found in consumer electronics.
It can be used on metal-to-metal meshing and sliding surfaces, it certainly won't hurt, but I prefer to use a different lube, such as the black moly, in those areas. To me, the Danco (and standard clear dielectric) silicone formulations seem a bit flimsy to hold up for the long term on higher pressure points (gear teeth, sliding plates, etc.; thinking mostly about changer mechanisms here).

For metal-to-metal, it really just comes down to personal preference, once the viscosity range is satisfied — not too thick and not too runny; you don't want it impeding movement and you don't want it to run to other areas like oil would. Some lubes can be thinned out; plenty of articles online about doing that if you want to experiment with say auto lubes.

Old record changers, for example, almost always have whitish lube on the metal parts. When I see that color, I think lithium-based. I know you're dealing with a turntable and not a changer, but I'm just using that as an example of what the industry thought best for production lines.

You may be properly served by a single tube of Super Lube for everything that doesn't need oil instead of grease. I can't speak to that, as I haven't used it, so I have zero experience in how it holds up long-term.
edit: Actually, there is another kind of "lube" that really can only be replaced with a specific type; it's called damping fluid. This is used on cueing mechanisms and cassette door hinges, etc. It's very thick and tacky stuff, which "softens" movement. For an LP, this is obviously important to keep the stylus from slamming down onto the record when you flip the cue lever. For tape decks, it's for aesthetics. It can be hard to find and pricey; fortunately, it rarely needs replacing if you don't spray cleaner in the area and dissolve the original.

I don't know how anyone gets away with not listing basic ingredients in an MSDS, but Synco Chemical Corp. has managed to do it, so we don't know what's in Super Lube except for the PTFE claim.
I'm not going to sit here and tell you to not try it. If it looks like something you want to try, then you can probably have it in your hands in a couple of days from Amazon with Prime.

I will say that whatever you use, do it in moderation. You will end up "messing" things up if you get overzealous. Most parts really don't require much lube at all; it's not like a car.

Last edited by Torque; 10-16-2018 at 01:39 AM.
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post #23 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 01:54 AM
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re: setting speed..

I always recommend doing so while the stylus is actually ON the record. So many people adjust speed with the tonearm parked. It can be cringeworthy.
There can actually be enough drag via the needle, even at spec'd tracking force, to slightly alter platter RPM. I've seen it. This is less of a concern with a really high mass platter coupled to an adequate motor (IOW, high quality table), but you'd be surprised at how much of a difference it makes on some tables, and people with "perfect pitch" can detect it.

I have an old, laminated GC strobe disc with error scales and the difference is quite noticeable — it's cut smaller than an LP so the operator can run it while playing the record.

There are also PDFs for printing your own. I'm not sure how accurate those are, but might be worth a shot.
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post #24 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 05:28 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the information guys!

Greg, the strobe is still working on it, so I'll try this when I'm done.

Torque, when I opened it up there was what looked like old grease on some plastic parts and just light oil on others. Searching around at different sites to figure out just what to get.

Will this work as an oil? Super Lube Oil.

Question. Anything to do with the motor, or just leave it if it's fine?

Joe

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post #25 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 08:35 AM
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Grog, I should get you to look at my old turntable. It's an Aikai direct drive, circa 1983. It has a pitch adjustment knob, which ironically is it's biggest issue. To get it to play at the correct speed I think I currently have it on 45 speed, turned down with the knob.

It's got major issues though. In addition to the pitch issue, the adjustable weight on the back of the arm is starting to fall out. It has had the pitch issue for 15-20 yrs, progressively getting worse. I was told it could be the power supply, or possible the rheostat or whatever controls the pitch knob. It has literally come to a stop while playing a few times.

I get it out every year or two, and play it for a couple months. The sound of a turntable is the true music - the drums just jump out of the speakers, and you can literally hear the guitar strings. I bought a vintage UK copy of Black Sabbath's first album last year.

Al

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post #26 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 11:32 AM
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About 1969 I bought a Pioneer PL-12D, and it has been trouble free. A few years back I went to my local Guitar Center to buy a new belt and a stylus. I believe they wanted about $75.00 for the two items.

While there I noticed a sale on new turntables for $99.00. I walked out with a brand new Stanton STR8-60 professional turntable. I don't know how professional it is, but I don't care. It has more features than the Pioneer, and it has been a great product except for the lid hinges failing. I still have the Pioneer table and the Pioneer SX626 receiver I bought with it.

The receiver is badly in need of repair as the buttons don't work well anymore. I think I will just replace it.

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post #27 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodeo Joe View Post
Will this work as an oil? Super Lube Oil.
I have no experience with that product. I found this older list of ingredients: https://pacbrake.com/wp-content/uplo...Oil-w-PTFE.pdf
However, the newer 2017 SDS from super-lube.com claims "trade secret" like the grease. They may have changed the formula over the years.

Quote:
Question. Anything to do with the motor, or just leave it if it's fine?
If there are no speed control/stability problems, I would leave it alone.
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post #28 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 10:21 PM
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I got a tube of phonolube from amazon today, so I'm good.

I prefer to stick with what I know. Certain oils dissolve things, so be extremely careful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird Bob View Post
About 1969 I bought a Pioneer PL-12D, and it has been trouble free. A few years back I went to my local Guitar Center to buy a new belt and a stylus. I believe they wanted about $75.00 for the two items.
I need to be selling you parts, lol. Need any silver speaker wire?

I just ordered an expensive elliptic diamond needle for my Shure m91E, and a belt, and it's $30 with shipping; be here tomorrow.


Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
Black '97 Tbird Limited Edition, '02 4R70W, 255 walbro, PST DS, PBR Brakes&SS lines, Toicko Blues & Springs, GrogTune.


"War Is Peace. Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength." - George Orwell.
Truth Isn't Truth. - Rudy Giuliani, 2018 Award winner, “Most Outrageous Diversion” by MSNBC for this quote

Last edited by Grog6; 10-16-2018 at 10:27 PM.
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post #29 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 11:13 PM
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I got a tube of phonolube from amazon today, so I'm good.
Are you sure it was "a" tube? I could only find this on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/ELECTRONICS-1.../dp/B011OA0VN0
Getting into Caig territory now.


Let me guess. You got the last one?
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post #30 of 40 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 11:52 PM
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Super Lube is available at Horror Fright: https://www.harborfreight.com/85-gra...dge-93744.html

Just throwing that out there for those inclined...
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