"Drifting"... WTH??!? - TCCoA Forums
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post #1 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 06:53 AM Thread Starter
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"Drifting"... WTH??!?

Ok, would someone care to "explain" the reasoning behind doing power slides around a track?!?!?

Last night I watched a few hours worth of “Formula D” trying to figure out the answer to just one question… WHY?!?!

Do these people just like buying tires and wheel bearings? I just don’t get it? The fastest way around a track is to NOT lose traction. Or is this up there with the “burnout” contests?

Maybe I’m too old, but I just don’t get it. Yes power slides are a blast…. to be doing… but not to be watching!

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post #2 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 06:56 AM
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I'm not completely sure I get it myself, but I think the point is your "form" and not so much about burning up the tires. Maybe, think of it more like dancing, or ballet?

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post #3 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 08:18 AM
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"Drifters burn em till they're done!!!!!!!!"

I almost puked when I heard that ricer say that. What a tool.

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post #4 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 08:20 AM
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yes. It requires much more squill then you think, especialls when drifting around s-curves etc. But, I do think drifting is pointless, and stupid in a kind of way. Its not the fastest way around a track, and it does put more wear and tear on your car. But, its not the track times, its about the style and skill.








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post #5 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 08:26 AM Thread Starter
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I was never belittling their skill. I just didn't understand it.

I’ve never really been a fan of any sport that has “judgment” as a factor as to who is better. I like quantitative competition.

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post #6 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 08:42 AM
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Drifting seems to be the new trend in automotive competition. I had never heard of it until recently, and now everybody and their brother is into it. I appreciate the skill involved, but I think it's ghey.

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post #7 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 09:45 AM
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94 DD I agree with you completely. But then we are the same age! Just makes no sense to me at all. It looks like a way for teenagers to show other teenagers "Hey look what I can do!". I know that isn't what it is, but thats what it looks like.


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post #8 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 09:50 AM
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its something for the useless ricers of the world to do, thats all "drifting" is. personally, id like to pull a nice brodie on a back road somewhere where there is noothing around for miles.

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post #9 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 10:19 AM
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there is an exit that is a complete circle near my home, I take it every day.

I seen a young kid with a 240sx nissan take it at about 90mph, its a 25-30 curve.

He must not have been really good at drifting or whatever because he sideswiped the concrete barrier then put it into the ditch.

I pulled over to see if he needed any help, he was ok but the car was screwed.
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post #10 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 01:51 PM
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Why don't they take up dirt track racing? They could make some good money racing sprint cars.

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post #11 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 02:23 PM
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Well, thinking positive here...maybe this would be an attempt to at least get some ricers to switch over the RWD?


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post #12 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
The fastest way around a track is to NOT lose traction.
depends on the track







I know what you mean though

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post #13 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 03:12 PM
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Driving is hard and thre is some form to it like dancing. It's sort of an art if you can do it. In the competetion they do a follow the leader type of thing where one car goes out and the other one is right behind it trying to follow its every move with being as close to the first car with out actually hitting it out of control. To drift the correct way alone is a little hard but to follow someone elses drift is every harder.

I agree that it is a pointless sport if you are trying not to put wear and tear on your car but I think it deserves respect as much as NASCAR and drag racing. Some of the drifting cars are so customized that it is pretty cool to see them and what they have done. It is hard to do and it's building quite a following in the states now which just means more car enthusiast, more aftermarket support, more attention to cars over all so we should be happy. I mean what, we go in a straight line, how stupid does it sound by it self and to someone not into it. And NASCAR, there is nor form, its just see who could go 100 laps around a oval the fastest or whatever.

Those are my thoughts. I am not saying this in response to anyone directly or knocking on any of the other "sports".

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post #14 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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Hehehehehe. I'm not a fan of Nascar nor a huge fan of drag racing (but if you're going to race somewhere, drag racing is about all there is )...

Give me Formula One ANY day of the week over any other type of automotive racing.

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post #15 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 03:53 PM
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F1 and IRL are it for me......

Better "quality" people in both those sports......F1 even more so than IRL.

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post #16 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 03:54 PM
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well i guess it depends on the car and on the track. yes its a technique that is very difficult but using my g-force steering wheel for gran turismo 4 it makes it very realistic. the concept of drifting isnt always mean the rear tires are loosing traction and completely not even helping the time. your supposed to adjust your throttle and spin your tires at the same speed your whole car is moving at. for helping out with track times i think its pretty even compared to grip racing. i play GT4 ALLLLLL the time and found out that when i tune a car for drift settings it can go through a corner without slowing down or using the brakes. i posted another thread in where i had drifting videos and i raced a saleen S7 in a wet track and i used a 240sx silvia s15. on the straight aways he would loose me but when a corner would come up he would slow down soooo much so he could grip, but while he was slowing down i was swinging the body weight from side to side and if you initiate it right you can go through that corner sliding at the same speed of the tires and taking a better line. in the pics below i made the angle of the car slide before the turn making me end up being able to go full throttle towards the middle of the turn. i guess it takes some practice. here are some racing simulator pics:





you can see that yea im sliding through the corners but i didnt have to use my brakes to slow down like everyone does before a corner. if you can maintain the speed of your tires then you can accomplish a lot with drifting

now for using it in real life for racing the lap times will be very close. but then again the person grip racing isnt wasting his tires like the drift racer. plus its a form i guess people give each other props on. but if i had to choose id go with grip racing seeing how you dont waste your tires and its easier to race then trying to get your car sideways.

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post #17 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
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If a tire is slipping in any way, shape, or form, it is taking energy (IMHO). Energy that could be going elsewhere. I would like to see exit speeds from a car setup to corner, vs. a car that is drifting a corner.

And yes I do agree that some oversteer can be beneficial in some racing. But what these people are doing is way, way beyond that.

If “drifting” was the fastest way around the track, wouldn’t you see F1 cars doing power slides all over the track?!?

And on a side note: I really need to get a PS2 and GT4!!!…. like I need a hole in my head… I have enough things to do besides sit for hours racing on TV!!! Hmmmm, maybe during the winter.

But just my .02 and I do recognize the skill involved. I just don't understand what they are attempting. Is it how fast they go around the track, or is it just how "well" they can get their car out of shape and still maintain control.

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post #18 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
I was never belittling their skill. I just didn't understand it.

I’ve never really been a fan of any sport that has “judgment” as a factor as to who is better. I like quantitative competition.
This is the biggest problem facing drifting. Because it is a judged sport, the possibility for bias among the judges is always there, as it is in gymnastics, skating or whatever. Some feel that the Japanese judges favor the Japanese drivers more than the Americans in series like D1, and I'll admit I've seen a few calls that have just left me shaking my head. But the primary reason to watch drifting is to admire a driver's car control, and it's either something you get or you don't. Also, seeing drifting in person is completely different than on TV. I've had the chance to cover numerous drift competitions and I love doing so, but I get no thrill from watching them on TV. If I'm not getting sprayed by tire chunks, the thrill isn't there. When Samuel Hubinette enters some of the Speed World Challenge races later this year, it should be really interesting to see how he compares to traditional road racers. Personally, I think he's got amazing talent and I'll be rooting for him (maybe because I know him, but still...).

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post #19 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
If a tire is slipping in any way, shape, or form, it is taking energy (IMHO). Energy that could be going elsewhere. I would like to see exit speeds from a car setup to corner, vs. a car that is drifting a corner.

And yes I do agree that some oversteer can be beneficial in some racing. But what these people are doing is way, way beyond that.

If “drifting” was the fastest way around the track, wouldn’t you see F1 cars doing power slides all over the track?!?

And on a side note: I really need to get a PS2 and GT4!!!…. like I need a hole in my head… I have enough things to do besides sit for hours racing on TV!!! Hmmmm, maybe during the winter.

But just my .02 and I do recognize the skill involved. I just don't understand what they are attempting. Is it how fast they go around the track, or is it just how "well" they can get their car out of shape and still maintain control.

Depending on the surface, and the style of racing, having a certain percentage of wheel spin is actually more efficient than having 100% traction through a corner. And actually, during drag racing, you can spin the wheels a certain percentage and still get the same amount of acceleration from the car. I wish I could remember the figures.

But yes, drifting is about how well you can take the corner sideways, the smoothness of the car around the corner, the form, etc. And also how well the car behind it is following and mimicking the car ahead of it. It's not about going around the fastest.

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post #20 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
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Depending on the surface, and the style of racing, having a certain percentage of wheel spin is actually more efficient than having 100% traction through a corner. And actually, during drag racing, you can spin the wheels a certain percentage and still get the same amount of acceleration from the car. I wish I could remember the figures.

But yes, drifint is about how well you can take the corner sideways, the smoothness of the car around the corner, the form, etc. And also how well the car behind it is following and mimicking the car ahead of it. It's not about going around the fastest.

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very well said. i dont think i could of said it any better

Quote:
If “drifting” was the fastest way around the track, wouldn’t you see F1 cars doing power slides all over the track?!?
its not the fastest, if i recall correctly i said its almost about the same. and f1's dont have races that are 2 laps long so they need to keep thier tires
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post #21 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
I was never belittling their skill. I just didn't understand it.

I’ve never really been a fan of any sport that has “judgment” as a factor as to who is better. I like quantitative competition.
Sorry, I just re-read my post, and it came off a little A-Holeish.



Quote:
Originally Posted by redneckcougarguy
its something for the useless ricers of the world to do, thats all "drifting" is. personally, id like to pull a nice brodie on a back road somewhere where there is noothing around for miles.
Not all drifters are ricers. The dumb kids that try it on public streets, yes. But the D1 GP cars I wouldnt consider rice. FD3S's, Skylines, AE86, GTO, Viper.. def. not rice...

Quote:
Originally Posted by porkchop2oo2
well i guess it depends on the car and on the track. yes its a technique that is very difficult but using my g-force steering wheel for gran turismo 4 it makes it very realistic. the concept of drifting isnt always mean the rear tires are loosing traction and completely not even helping the time. your supposed to adjust your throttle and spin your tires at the same speed your whole car is moving at. for helping out with track times i think its pretty even compared to grip racing. i play GT4 ALLLLLL the time and found out that when i tune a car for drift settings it can go through a corner without slowing down or using the brakes. i posted another thread in where i had drifting videos and i raced a saleen S7 in a wet track and i used a 240sx silvia s15. on the straight aways he would loose me but when a corner would come up he would slow down soooo much so he could grip, but while he was slowing down i was swinging the body weight from side to side and if you initiate it right you can go through that corner sliding at the same speed of the tires and taking a better line. in the pics below i made the angle of the car slide before the turn making me end up being able to go full throttle towards the middle of the turn. i guess it takes some practice. here are some racing simulator pics:

[IMG]http://members.tccoa.com/tccoamike/IMG0010.jpg
[IMG]http://members.tccoa.com/tccoamike/IMG0011.jpg
[IMG]http://members.tccoa.com/tccoamike/IMG0023.jpg
you can see that yea im sliding through the corners but i didnt have to use my brakes to slow down like everyone does before a corner. if you can maintain the speed of your tires then you can accomplish a lot with drifting

now for using it in real life for racing the lap times will be very close. but then again the person grip racing isnt wasting his tires like the drift racer. plus its a form i guess people give each other props on. but if i had to choose id go with grip racing seeing how you dont waste your tires and its easier to race then trying to get your car sideways.

-Mike
I can never drift in GT4. So, Now I mostly go to that french track, and drage race down the 4 mile long straight..

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinH
there is an exit that is a complete circle near my home, I take it every day.

I seen a young kid with a 240sx nissan take it at about 90mph, its a 25-30 curve.

He must not have been really good at drifting or whatever because he sideswiped the concrete barrier then put it into the ditch.

I pulled over to see if he needed any help, he was ok but the car was screwed.
Gotta love the kids that think the 240SX=Automatic drift car..








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post #22 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 07:46 PM
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Japanese aren't the only ones that drift.. This is a badass 04 GTO that was a drifting car on C&D TV and I have seen it on another show too. A lot people don't like him because he is like Jeff Gordon (aka, he can drive damn good and has a powerful car).

I personally like drifting, I think it is awesome, and its great that some new ideas are being tried instead of the tried and true straight line / oval race.

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post #23 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 07:51 PM
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Drifting is a good way for dumb teenagers to get rid of ricemobiles. When professionals do it, it's actually pretty cool, but there's been a lot of accidents caused by kids trying to drift their neons or civics with the handbrake.

I'm gonna have to agree with 94DD here. The best form of racing is F1, both from a viewing standpoint, and a tech standpoint. The engineering work that goes into those cars is astounding. I'm part of a college formula race team, Formula SAE, where we design, build, and race scaled-down Formula cars powered by 600cc motorcycle engines. Next week I get to race it.

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post #24 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 07:54 PM
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i thought that race was this week SloMo, or was the presentation this week? my g/f is on the akron team, and she tells me things and i forget. a lot.

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post #25 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 07:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1997T-Bird
Japanese aren't the only ones that drift.. This is a badass 04 GTO that was a drifting car on C&D TV and I have seen it on another show too. A lot people don't like him because he is like Jeff Gordon (aka, he can drive damn good and has a powerful car).
You're talking about Rhys Millen, and he's arguably the best drifter in the US. Most drift fans get along with him okay--actually, he's one of the most popular drifters. It's only the ricers who hate American cars who boo him, and once Hubinette brought out the Viper Comp Coupe, that stole most of the negative energy away from Millen.

And for what it's worth, I don't know any real drifter who's ever said that drifting through a corner is faster than normal road racing technique.

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post #26 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 08:04 PM
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a little something to show you guys drifting isnt pointless

Huge vid might take 5 minutes to download
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post #27 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 09:29 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2002
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I love it when kids use video games to attempt to prove points about real life.

R.I.P. Joel Bender 07/30/79 - 03/26/06
R.I.P. Johnny Langton 1975-2011

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post #28 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 09:58 PM
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maybe when its a real racing simulator? ummm thats what the gt series have been famous for. play the new gt4 game with the gt forcepro steering wheel. as real as you can get.
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post #29 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 10:01 PM
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Maybe as real as you can get in a video game, it's far from a "real racing simulator" or real life.

R.I.P. Joel Bender 07/30/79 - 03/26/06
R.I.P. Johnny Langton 1975-2011

1997 Thunderbird LX 4.6 AED 349.27RWHP/391.29RWTQ Engine Build Exterior shots
2002 Thunderbird Premium Triple Black 3.9
2015 Fusion Energi SE Luxury Magnetic Gray
*SCRAPPED* 1994 LX 4.6 NA [email protected] 236.07RWHP/286.26RWTQ
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post #30 of 63 (permalink) Old 05-09-2005, 10:08 PM
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The presentation (well, ours, anyway) is Wednesday, and the competition is the 18th to the 22nd. The autocross is on the 20th and the endurance race is on the 21st.

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