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post #1 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 06:26 PM Thread Starter
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PI TBird times?

Just curious. I want find out if anyone has a quarter mile time for a stock PI 4.6 in a t-bird. I'm going to a track rental soon and I have to set up some grudge racing, and I'm thinking 14.5-14.9, but my friend said the car feels much stronger than high 14s. This is a stock PI motor with stock transmission and 3.08 gears
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post #2 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 07:15 PM
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With a stock transmission and 3.08's you'll be lucky to see high 14's on a downhill track with a tailwind.

I'd say you'll do low to mid 15's. Do you have any other mods like a Program or Exhaust? Or even a Jmod? What tires are you planning on running?

With my stock motor, a Maurader TC (2,800 stall), 3.73's and a borrowed MAF and program the best I could muster was a 14.7 on street tires.

Mods? Yea, I got mods ...
Air silencer delete, warp drive, dilithium crystals, flux capacitor, Slingshot Rubber band power adder, Moonshine & Gas, Leaf Blower Supercharger, Hamster Wheel & Hamster, Energizer Bunny generating 1.21 gigawatts, Mr. Fusion® Home Energy Reactor, hover conversion and a sextant celestial navigation system (The original GPS)
Best 1/4: 1,320 nanoseconds @ 670,616,629.2 miles per hour

"There isn't that much difference anymore between spacecraft, aircraft and modern automobiles..." - Keith Henry, NASA's Langley Research Center
See a list of my real mods and pictures of my car HERE. The true performance of my car was made possible by the Carolinas Crew Chief, RobertP at Rob's Tire & Auto

Last edited by Trunk Monkey; 03-26-2010 at 07:27 PM. Reason: ask about Jmod
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post #3 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 07:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trunk Monkey View Post
With a stock transmission and 3.08's you'll be lucky to see high 14's on a downhill track with a tailwind.

I'd say you'll do low to mid 15's. Do you have any other mods like a Program or Exhaust? What tires are you planning on running?

With my stock motor, a Maurader TC (2,800 stall), 3.73's and a borrowed MAF and program the best I could muster was a 14.7 on street tires.
stock exhaust, street tires, by then i should have a tune, and it has a cai. bone stock NPI i ran a 15.8, and after i did the PI intake, it was alot faster. now that i have the engine swap, im wondering what itll do
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post #4 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 07:35 PM
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15.40 unless u got minesfaft air

my buddies same setupbut a mark 8 tc ran 15.0 in very good air

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post #5 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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my 0-60 time's also down to 6.4 seconds from 7.9. would this help estimate any different?
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post #6 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 08:06 PM
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My car runs a 14.1 on a stock converter leaving off idle. But I have a full bolt on PI engine, 11:1 compression, 4.10's, and tuned.

I honestly don't think you will see high 14's either. But hey, if you do then great.

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post #7 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 08:27 PM
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i went 14.2o's with a 99 pi engine and a 2500 converter and 3.27's

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NMRA MM7270 -- NMCA EFI/? ????
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post #8 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VicRattlehead View Post
i went 14.2o's with a 99 pi engine and a 2500 converter and 3.27's
Geez, I need a stall bad!! My 2.3 60 ft times just aren't getting it done!

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post #9 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 08:46 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VicRattlehead View Post
i went 14.2o's with a 99 pi engine and a 2500 converter and 3.27's
was that a stock motor?
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post #10 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 08:47 PM
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yea, its still stock, some n2o and it runs 12.40's

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best ET: 12.410 -- best MPH: 107.61
NMRA MM7270 -- NMCA EFI/? ????
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post #11 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 09:12 PM Thread Starter
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yea, its still stock, some n2o and it runs 12.40's
oh wow, thats really good. how come some are different and people are sayin i wont make it outa the 15's? my friend had his car and it ran low to mid 14s and he said its as fast as that was. and i raced my friends stock tbird, same year as mine and smoked him
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post #12 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 10:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VicRattlehead View Post
i went 14.2o's with a 99 pi engine and a 2500 converter and 3.27's
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyD. View Post
oh wow, thats really good. how come some are different and people are sayin i wont make it outa the 15's? my friend had his car and it ran low to mid 14s and he said its as fast as that was. and i raced my friends stock tbird, same year as mine and smoked him.
You won't make it out of the 15's because - and this list is by no means all inclusive - you don't have a 2,500 or higher converter, you don't have 3.27 or higher gears, you don't have a Jmod, and you don't have any exhaust mods.

You will smoke a same year stock Tbird because you have a PI engine and your friend doesn't. That's no surprise and doesn't mean that you have a 14.x car.

Trying to estimate your performance based on other peoples results is really just a guessing game. Take it to the track and then come back and let us know how you did.
Video and time-slips are always appreciated around here.

Hey, if you break a 14.9 or better I'll be happy for you. I just don't think it'll happen.

Mods? Yea, I got mods ...
Air silencer delete, warp drive, dilithium crystals, flux capacitor, Slingshot Rubber band power adder, Moonshine & Gas, Leaf Blower Supercharger, Hamster Wheel & Hamster, Energizer Bunny generating 1.21 gigawatts, Mr. Fusion® Home Energy Reactor, hover conversion and a sextant celestial navigation system (The original GPS)
Best 1/4: 1,320 nanoseconds @ 670,616,629.2 miles per hour

"There isn't that much difference anymore between spacecraft, aircraft and modern automobiles..." - Keith Henry, NASA's Langley Research Center
See a list of my real mods and pictures of my car HERE. The true performance of my car was made possible by the Carolinas Crew Chief, RobertP at Rob's Tire & Auto

Last edited by Trunk Monkey; 03-26-2010 at 10:48 PM.
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post #13 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 10:45 PM
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Slightly off but slightly on topic.

I'm planning on a Mark VIII or Marauder converter upgrade either this year or next (depends on the budget/free time). A new exhaust is also on my mind but probably won't happen this year. Would you say those combined with my current mods would theoretically put me into the 14s? In my time lurking the things I've read seem to suggest it would be close but the estimates I've found always seem to be based off a slightly different setup than mine. I'm not all that interested in making a pass (at least not until I get my transmission rebuilt/replaced - I'd rather keep it living as long as possible), but I have this underlying curiosity to know about where I'd be placed for comparison sake.

Trunk Monkey - again, slightly off topic but how much of a handling improvement did you notice when you went from the Indy 500s to your current tires on the wider rims? I've still got my 500s on the car until I can afford two more tires for the new wheels.

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post #14 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trunk Monkey View Post

Hey, if you break a 14.9 or better I'll be happy for you. I just don't think it'll happen.
i went 14.9 with a tune and good air, on a npi engine. stock converter, and stock 3.27's

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NMRA MM7270 -- NMCA EFI/? ????
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post #15 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:05 PM
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Slightly off but slightly on topic.

I'm planning on a Mark VIII or Marauder converter upgrade either this year or next (depends on the budget/free time). A new exhaust is also on my mind but probably won't happen this year. Would you say those combined with my current mods would theoretically put me into the 14s?

In my time lurking the things I've read seem to suggest it would be close but the estimates I've found always seem to be based off a slightly different setup than mine. I'm not all that interested in making a pass (at least not until I get my transmission rebuilt/replaced - I'd rather keep it living as long as possible), but I have this underlying curiosity to know about where I'd be placed for comparison sake.

Trunk Monkey - again, slightly off topic but how much of a handling improvement did you notice when you went from the Indy 500s to your current tires on the wider rims? I've still got my 500s on the car until I can afford two more tires for the new wheels.
  • A Mark VIII or Marauder converter is a must. On a mildly built N/A engine I wouldn't go any higher than 2,800 stall.
  • Exhaust will help but not as much as other upgrades save it for later in your build, go with the next two items first.
  • You need gear - 3.73 at a minimum and 4.10's would be worth considering.
  • You need a posi-lock to keep the one wheel wonder from spinning at the line.
  • A tune and a better MAF than the stock one.
  • The Jmod will help firm your shifts up - a big help when you're trying to get down the track quickly and a relatively inexpensive upgrade.


Handling and traction improved tremendously with the Sumo's on 9" rims. Ride comfort also suffered proportionally. It's a trade off. But worth it IMO. They worked fine with my N/A set-up. But now that it's blown I'm looking for something much stickier.

Mods? Yea, I got mods ...
Air silencer delete, warp drive, dilithium crystals, flux capacitor, Slingshot Rubber band power adder, Moonshine & Gas, Leaf Blower Supercharger, Hamster Wheel & Hamster, Energizer Bunny generating 1.21 gigawatts, Mr. Fusion® Home Energy Reactor, hover conversion and a sextant celestial navigation system (The original GPS)
Best 1/4: 1,320 nanoseconds @ 670,616,629.2 miles per hour

"There isn't that much difference anymore between spacecraft, aircraft and modern automobiles..." - Keith Henry, NASA's Langley Research Center
See a list of my real mods and pictures of my car HERE. The true performance of my car was made possible by the Carolinas Crew Chief, RobertP at Rob's Tire & Auto
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post #16 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:26 PM
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Thanks for your insights, very helpful and welcome as always.

I'm definitely on the way to a TL rear end (which I'll probably do when I put in the Mark DS), but as far as gearing I'm still undecided. Like I said I'm not much into racing but I do like to be able to have a little fun every now and then. Fuel economy is always on my mind too.

As of now I've got a 93 tune by Lonnie as well as an 02 GT MAF with the J-Mod, PI intake and cams, 180 T-stat, K&N filter to go with the GT intake assembly, and a mid-sized tranny cooler. I don't think I'll be doing anything else to the engine in the near future.

The bigger tires were influenced mainly by the fact that I hate the traction control kicking in every time I hit the gas from a stop. The one time I turned it off I spun the ... tire... and it was very unexciting.

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post #17 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:36 PM Thread Starter
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where can i get a mark viii converter?
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post #18 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:43 PM
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They pop for sale on here every now and then, or you can try a local yard.

-Brandon
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post #19 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-26-2010, 11:56 PM Thread Starter
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what about the pro-king torque converters from advance auto parts? theyre remans, but for 130 bucks, it might be worth it to try
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post #20 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 12:01 AM
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if you want a converter get one from alan. dirtydogperformance.com

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post #21 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VicRattlehead View Post
i went 14.9 with a tune and good air, on a npi engine. stock converter, and stock 3.27's
Yeah, and I'm Santa Claus! You are full of it with only those mods on an NPI! You only ran what on a PI motor combination after that? Come on Keith.

Tony, as Trunk Monkey spoke you will need the additional pieces to really make the PI engine work well. That is the converter, gears, Maf, good Dyno tune, adjusted shift points and lock up schedules, exhaust, JMOD, and good tires for the track.

It is the combination of parts and learning how to run the car on the track that will make the difference, as well as track location and conditions as others have mentioned. The likely hood of High 14's are possible but like the others I'd be more likely to anticipate low 15's, especially on street tires and 3.08's.

The stock PI engine with the added components listed could easily put you in the low to mid 13's with time and practice on race tires. Stock NPI's with the full contigent of bolt on's, tunes etc have gone as low as 13.9-14.2s as Johnny Langton, mine, 95LX and maybe a couple others have done in the past.

For example, I know of one particular car in our group with just a PI swap no tune and street tires that has gone a 14.8-9 with basically no other parts or tune. On the other hand I have a 95 XR7 Stock, 120K miles with a stock 95NPI (120K+ miles) with underdrives, tune, 3.73's's, K & N, 70 MM TB, Otherwise stock that has gone a best of 15.0 with 27" drag tires. It might run 14's with shorter tires but it is what it is.

I hope this information is useful to you. Good luck!

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post #22 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 10:55 AM Thread Starter
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this helps out alot. i was expecting about 14.9 but hoping for less. i got pretty decent reaction time. my first time out was a .067, not that its perfect but pretty good. but im planning on getting all the parts after im done. this is just to know what im starting about with
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post #23 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 10:59 AM
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My car with just a PI motor and no tune or other mods went 15.2 @ 93mph. Tuned it went 14.4.

04 PI swap,SVO Supercharger 8-9 psi,Alcohol injection,39lbs Cobra injectors,XCal2-Walbro 255 LPH fuel pump,4.10 T-Lok,2003 4R70W built to withstand by RobertP,450hp JMOD,3800 circleD stall,trucool 4739 Trans Cooler,Dynotech 3.5 Driveshaft,70mm T/B,SCP Cold Air Intake,90mm LMAF,JBA headers,Magnaflow Midmount,No cats with 3inch piping,Vogtland 1.6inch drop,Cobra R's and xenon body kit.

Its slow, Really.
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post #24 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 11:17 AM Thread Starter
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My car with just a PI motor and no tune or other mods went 15.2 @ 93mph. Tuned it went 14.4.
jeez, so when they said tuned it feels like a whole new car isnt a joke
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post #25 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 11:26 AM
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It depends on who you have tune it I guess. Some people know how to get the most out of the tuning with these cars.

04 PI swap,SVO Supercharger 8-9 psi,Alcohol injection,39lbs Cobra injectors,XCal2-Walbro 255 LPH fuel pump,4.10 T-Lok,2003 4R70W built to withstand by RobertP,450hp JMOD,3800 circleD stall,trucool 4739 Trans Cooler,Dynotech 3.5 Driveshaft,70mm T/B,SCP Cold Air Intake,90mm LMAF,JBA headers,Magnaflow Midmount,No cats with 3inch piping,Vogtland 1.6inch drop,Cobra R's and xenon body kit.

Its slow, Really.
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post #26 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 02:56 PM
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with my 95 bird I ran a 14.5. my mods are 04 PI motor out of a crown vic, C&L intake elbow, 73mm TB, C&L MAF, CAI, flowmaster exhaust, 2000 mustang GT 4R70W, 93 mark VIII drive shaft, 3.73 w/trac lok, and a tune. I just put the car in drive turned OD off and power braked it to 1200 RPMs. I know that sounds like a lot to do to get them into a 14s but my transmission was for a junk yard and I did not have the money to have it looked over or to put a shift kit in it. so I would have to say for you to make it there you will need a tune, J mod, 3.73 gears or higher, exhaust, and a good set of tires on the rear, that should get you there. another good tip would be to go out and do a few short runs in a parking lot to get the hang on getting out of the hole faster and to see were you will start spinning your tires so you know what RPM you could hold it at.

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full PI swap (03 grand marquis engine), 2000 Mustang GT 4R70W, C & L intake elbow, 73mm TB, 73mm MAF housing, CAI, flowmaster exhaust, 3.73 w/ trac lock and upgraded clutches, BOC tune.
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post #27 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 04:41 PM
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i have ran a best time of 14.2 on bald tires and my other times have been anywhere from 14.3 to 14.7 the car has pi cams pi intake 3.73 posi rear a tune steeda pullys this is all according to my scanguage which is somewhat close to kinda sorta maybe just possibly being a little accurate i really think given the conditions it could run a 14 flat as it sits

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post #28 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 04:44 PM
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It depends on who you have tune it I guess. Some people know how to get the most out of the tuning with these cars.
just curious was this a tune by lonnie or a custom dyno tune? cause thats a huge difference.

wow you guys are all over the place with these numbers and mods.
i bet with my mods Im still well into the 15s. maybe get in to the 14s with tune, torque converter, and posi-lock? and of course some practice.

i was really hoping that xcal II was going to come through for me but someone decided not to sent it... ugh

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post #29 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 05:47 PM Thread Starter
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how many of you guys just put it in drive to race? i love shiftin through the gears
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post #30 of 47 (permalink) Old 03-27-2010, 06:17 PM
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how many of you guys just put it in drive to race? i love shiftin through the gears


It's the best way to do it.

pics of my car
http://forums.tccoa.com/showthread.p...ght=train+yard

Updated 10/14/11
3800 Dirty Dog installed and drag radials
13.0 @ 106.5 1.79 60ft
R8D-XXX is offline  
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