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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-26-2015, 09:55 PM Thread Starter
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project Stock car reboot.

Hello

I am putting my factory stock, stock car back together.

Just received my new tool today.
cam bearing tool. cam bearings came in as well.

Engine:
1986 351w.
stock compression using all stock parts.
must keep 8.5 compression.
iron heads & intake.
going with my oval track .450 lift Comp Cams cam
upgrading valve springs to match the cam.
I have to swap the 4bbl. intake for a 2bbl intake.

Now i need time to work on it!!

Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-28-2015, 08:26 AM
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I know I love a good 351W. I don't know much about circle track racing these days. Are these a "spec" engine or something like the old "Claimer" engines?

What heads can you use? Any factory cast iron head? Any intake with a 2V flange? Or a 4V intake with a 2V adapter? 2 Barrel Holly or something modern? Early 351 Windsor Heads or Later Mustang GT style heads. Valve sizes? Porting?

I think I loved about upstate NY is the the fact that short track and dirt racing is was still a big thing. Back when I drove over the road you had to make sure you didn't get held up or called ahead as you might find the customers whole shop had left early on a Friday too either go racing or take their families. It was a major social event and I always thought that was great.
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-28-2015, 03:33 PM Thread Starter
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Heads & intake



Nope not a claimer engine!

I can run any factory production Ford head as long as it keeps the 8.5 compression ratio.

I MUST run a cast iron 2bbl. intake manifold,
Ford stock 2bbl. or Holley 7448 2bbl. (350cfm)

I run on asphalt, 5.8 mile D shaped oval.


Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-28-2015, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbirdtess View Post


Nope not a claimer engine!

I can run any factory production Ford head as long as it keeps the 8.5 compression ratio.

I MUST run a cast iron 2bbl. intake manifold,
Ford stock 2bbl. or Holley 7448 2bbl. (350cfm)

I run on asphalt, 5.8 mile D shaped oval.

Did Ford make a decent iron 2V manifold? 1982 Mustang GT maybe? You can run any CC chambered head and adjust the compression via the dome or dish on the slug I assume? That would open up a lot of options. Any ignition? Roller or flat tappet? Any ratio rocker arm? I'm probably wrong but weren't some of the Ford truck Holly's so closer to 500CFM? I haven't though about carbs in a decade. I still got the suitcase full of pump cams, jets and springs from my drag race pre fuel injection days

There something to be said for finding just the right fuel and ignition curves and really make that motor sing

Any trans restrictions., 4 speed? 5 speed? What type of rear gear do you run with a 2V like that. Do you try to take advantage of high speed torque and gear it up or gear it down to run at maximum RPM.

5.8 miles is long! I'm guessing you meant 5/8 paved but I haven't been to any circle races in a long time.

You have a a head casting picked out? Valve sizes? I'm assuming your doing some port work? At bare minimum gasket matching and bowl work. Ain't nothing quite like a nose full of iron dust lol

Good luck. I'll be interested to see how this progresses.
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-28-2015, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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I a word NO!!

Rules make us run a Slug.

Factory stock for all.

Cast iron Block, heads intake & exhaust. 351w only
stock lift & rocker ratio. no rollers, cam or lifters.
no port a polish to anything.
max valve is 1.94I & 1.50E

No the truck carbs only run about 350cfm. with smog.
The only Holley We can run as an option is the 7448. 350cfm.

I run a Dura spark II system.

WE can only run a 3 speed auto trany. C-4 + open rear gear. 3.90 max ratio(ford)


As for the Mustangs. They were CFI or 4bbl. in early 80's.

So I basically took all my 70's Torino stuff & put in my 90's T-bird.

351w, C-4 3.90 open rear.
still have the IRS suspension.
We race in second gear. so that gives me 5.69 rear ratio.
Racing aluminum 1" tubed radiator + electric fan. still over heat.
I have a 1.23 Autolite carb., damn thing is older than me.

Working on aluminum upper front shock mounts.
using the cases for the lowers & Bilstein racing shocks.
Must be stock appearing, so still have the 5" springs.

The car was fast but pushes threw the corners.

tbirdtess

Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-29-2015, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbirdtess View Post


I a word NO!!

Rules make us run a Slug.

Factory stock for all.

Cast iron Block, heads intake & exhaust. 351w only
stock lift & rocker ratio. no rollers, cam or lifters.
no port a polish to anything.
max valve is 1.94I & 1.50E

No the truck carbs only run about 350cfm. with smog.
The only Holley We can run as an option is the 7448. 350cfm.

I run a Dura spark II system.

WE can only run a 3 speed auto trany. C-4 + open rear gear. 3.90 max ratio(ford)


As for the Mustangs. They were CFI or 4bbl. in early 80's.

So I basically took all my 70's Torino stuff & put in my 90's T-bird.

351w, C-4 3.90 open rear.
still have the IRS suspension.
We race in second gear. so that gives me 5.69 rear ratio.
Racing aluminum 1" tubed radiator + electric fan. still over heat.
I have a 1.23 Autolite carb., damn thing is older than me.

Working on aluminum upper front shock mounts.
using the cases for the lowers & Bilstein racing shocks.
Must be stock appearing, so still have the 5" springs.

The car was fast but pushes threw the corners.

tbirdtess
Wow that is STOCK.

The 1982 GT introduced the 5.0 HO. And reignited the pony car battles. The reason I mentioned it was that the very first year it sported a 365 CFM 2 barrel carb. Double roller chain, improved exhaust and what was billed as a marine cam in the media of the day. I think but am not positive that the cam carried the 351W firing order I'd have to look deeper. 8.4 CR. I know later on the HOs used the 351W firing order. No 4V till 83 when the car got hit with the ugly stick. Then CFI and the Multi port FI. But it all started with a 2V. I know. I Lusted after one of those in "Rude Red" for many years. With the Indy Pace car spoiler these were probably the best looking of the early Foxes. The Capri before it went to the bubble back was pretty sweet to.


I thought of the 1982 GT because it was a 2V with the right compression. When I built the 351W in my 78 ranchero I dressed it out with the dual snorkel air cleaner. And the early 80's cast Powered by Ford valve covers and close to the same cam. With 4160 on aftermarket manifold and long tube 1970-1971 Headers and duals it ran really well and would rev to 5400-5600 pulling the whole way. And that's as fast I would want to rev a tired short block anyway. 3.50 TLock and a FMX. The FMX was the one thing holding the car back. There's just not much you can do with one. But it was solid so I left it in till I sold the car.

But yeah your really stuck with stock. I didn't think it would be quite that restrictive. 2nd gear with a C4 and a 3.90 gear must keep that pretty wound up. What kind of RPM are you turning on the straights?

As I'm sure your well aware most stock Duraspark II distributer have a extremely tight centrifugal advance curve. Terrible terrible curve. The 79-1981 cars weren't actually getting any advance till about 5000. And considering the heads shut down around 4400 that made it nearly useless. I set up the 302 in a buddy's 1979 Cobra and changing the springs and weights made the single biggest difference. We didn't have Dynos back then. Just stop watches and telephone poles

Contemporary media says the early 5.0 HO actually used a 1973 Torino cam instead of the marine pieced touted in the adds. I do remember adds for the 351W HO truck motor also listing a marine cam. There was a pre lightning 351W HO truck motor option. They are pretty rare. I only saw one in the boneyard and that's where I got my dual snorkel air air cleaner from. Although I believe the the 351W HO used a 4180 Holly. I think I may still have that carb.

1.23......I LIKE cracker box Autolites. Some of the aftermarket Holly stuff will fit. Although the jets are numbered different. But in some respects the Autolite was a Holly with a one peice bowl casting. Most people have no idea that all of the performance Holly carbs were first used on Ford engines. IIRC the correctly the 4150 was used with mods on the E birds with 312's, the 4160 on the 2x4V 427 and the Dominator was designed for the Boss 429.

So is this together and running? Or are you currently putting it together?
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-29-2015, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
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Next step



Well the next step will be the cam bearings.

So the engine is a bare block right now.

I don't need a cam. I have my Comp cams, low lift oval cam.
has 300* of duration, .450 lift.
maybe to much cam.

The carb rule is stock 2bbl. or 7448 Holley.
I have been running my 1.23, No choke butterfly.

I also have a 1.33, Planing on running but after i get her running.
I know the 1.23 is good!

I get 6200-6300 rpm with this combo. (other engine)
I get full advance at about 3000, advance curve not an issue.
upper shaft movement may be an issue. old upper bushing.

AND PLEASE!
Spell HOLLEY correctly.

Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 06-29-2015, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbirdtess View Post


Well the next step will be the cam bearings.

So the engine is a bare block right now.

I don't need a cam. I have my Comp cams, low lift oval cam.
has 300* of duration, .450 lift.
maybe to much cam.

The carb rule is stock 2bbl. or 7448 Holley.
I have been running my 1.23, No choke butterfly.

I also have a 1.33, Planing on running but after i get her running.
I know the 1.23 is good!

I get 6200-6300 rpm with this combo. (other engine)
I get full advance at about 3000, advance curve not an issue.
upper shaft movement may be an issue. old upper bushing.

AND PLEASE!
Spell HOLLEY correctly.
Are upper distributer bushing still available?

Good point on the spelling my bad. George Holley is probably rolling over in his grave.

That seems like a lot of duration. Depending on lobe centers. I'll admit to being clueless about circle track cams. Street strip cams I know a little about.
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