1 3/8 Read Addco - TCCoA Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 12:18 PM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
1 3/8 Read Addco

With my recent fuel pump replacement project, I did the usual "while I'm there" and installed 3.73 LT and a 1 3/8” anti-sway bar.

My question is: How bad is the oversteer going to be with a stock front Mark VIII LSC bar and a 1 3/8 rear bar?

It’s probably going to be a few months before I get around to doing the front bar…

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 02:46 PM
Seasoned PostWhore

Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Age: 37
Posts: 7,462
Garage
Send a message via AIM to MadMikeyL
I don't know about the Addco bar, but I did ride in a 97 MarkVIII with an 89SC rear bar, and stock front bar, and that was actually a big improvement over stock. It did give a bit of a tendency to oversteer when pushed, but it got rid of all the understeer, so it made the car a lot more fun. I don't know how much stiffer the Addco is, but considering the 89SC bar was the stiffest stock one available, I suspect it would probably be pretty similar with the addco bar.

-91 Cougar LS, coming soon, complete overhaul with a 427" Windsor.
-90 XR7 5-speed black on black w/sunroof, MP2, coated rotors, double intercooler, 15%OD, ported heads, comp stage 1 cam, 85mm TB, 90MM LMAF, 80# injectors, and ported big valve heads
-98 Mark VIII LSC, Procharger P600b, TR3650 swap and 3.73s.
-90 SC Automatic rustbucket winter beater
-97 Tbird Sport 4.6 Nice weather daily driver
-"Your buddy Mike is INSANE!" -ClintD's dad
MadMikeyL is offline  
post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 06:07 PM
PostWhore
The AFDB is on a lil tight.
 
Splattered's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: is hot
Posts: 3,868
Youll notice big time but you dont have drive fast either so if you drive really mellow on the pedal then youll be fine with it. The worst thing is that youll notice how sloppy the front twists on bumps.

Spinning pies like wheels.

DD driving my 20 year old project

Now with new ball joints...again
Splattered is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 07:47 PM
PostWhore
 
CrystalPistol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Age: 65
Posts: 1,032
Wet roads will be "fun", especially when that curve slips up on you at 2:13 AM.

A fine pair ... ... and whatever you do, Have a Safe Trip!
CrystalPistol is offline  
post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 06:14 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
Thanks guys. I sort of figured it would get rid of the built in understeer and move the handling to oversteer (which I prefer).

I don't drive the LSC very much nor very agressively, so I should be fine until I get the front done.

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 09:39 PM
PostWhore
 
driller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Morgantown, WV
Posts: 1,267
Send a message via AIM to driller
Generally the advice is a max 1-1/4 bar for the rear with a stock front bar. You may want to consider upgrading the front to a 1-1/8 in the future.

Personally I call my 1-1/4 rear sway bar my 'rear steer' mod.
driller is offline  
post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-17-2010, 01:23 PM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
Well, I found out....

Here's my take: It is fine on smooth, sweeping curves. It sucks big time on tight turns!

What appears to happen is in a tight turn the front rolls with the stock front suspension, but the rear does not. So the front does a nose dive on the outer wheel wanting to accelerate your turn, which in turn makes the rear end want to come around. It almost acts like a three wheeler.

With the tight (extra clutches and stiffer spring) trac lock, 3.73’s, poly bushings on the knuckle, and this sway bar the car now REALLY feels squirrely. Thank goodness for the Gen II's traction control. It is definitely a handful.

A caveat though is that my front suspension is bone stock and I suspect my “shocks” inside the air bags are getting weak. My front bounces a little more than I care for, but I’m not sure if it is supposed to be that way (i.e “Luxury”) or if the shocks are shot.

I don’t even want to think what all this twisting is doing to the unibody.

Just thought I would share my experiences.

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-17-2010, 08:42 PM
PostWhore
 
driller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Morgantown, WV
Posts: 1,267
Send a message via AIM to driller
Makes me glad I went with the 1-1/4 then. It is predictable and it can do a pretty mean power slide.
driller is offline  
post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-17-2010, 08:58 PM
Voice/Data Guru
 
Boston-Bull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Grapevine TX
Posts: 7,781
Quote:
Originally Posted by driller View Post
Makes me glad I went with the 1-1/4 then. It is predictable and it can do a pretty mean power slide.

Same here as well

2017 Mustang GT 5.0L 2nd gen, cold air box,tune,6 speed auto,RGR 3.31, Magnaflow Tru X-pipe ,GT350RStrips
Gray Mustang Registry # 8582


Boston-Bull is offline  
post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-17-2010, 09:25 PM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
tbirdtess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western New York
Age: 53
Posts: 2,542
Up

Hello

Looks like I need a bigger rear bar. A little understeer going in.
I have a solid .94 rear bar.


Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
tbirdtess is offline  
post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-17-2010, 09:38 PM
PostWhore
The AFDB is on a lil tight.
 
Splattered's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: is hot
Posts: 3,868
I knew it wouldn't feel right. Even sized bars are the only way to go when you want to get these to handle. I did the power slide thing when I did my rear only but its much more fun with both bars and gears.

Spinning pies like wheels.

DD driving my 20 year old project

Now with new ball joints...again
Splattered is offline  
post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-18-2010, 06:01 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
What is interesting is that when I originally installed this rear bar on the T'bird I also did Eibach springs front and rear (but not the front 1 3/8), and it didn't make this much difference.

I think it is a combination of the soft stock suspension and the larger rear bar. On my T'bird with 1 3/8 F&R and Eibachs the car handled great.

I'm hoping for the same with the LSC but with a softer ride with the air suspension.

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-18-2010, 10:37 AM
Listening on 141.850 mHz!
 
Gonzalo Duque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Westland, Michigan
Age: 55
Posts: 829
Glad I read this, I'm wanting to change out the stock hollow rear sway bar on my 97 LSC as well. Now I'm not in any rush. Your car is a clone of mine!

94 Daily Driven - what program do you have on your chip and where did you get it? I'm looking at a chip for mine, plus the 1-2 accumulator piston, Mercon V fluid change and a true dual system in the near future.

Gonzalo Duque "Gonzo"
1997 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC 4.6L Cobra V8
1997 Thunderbird Limited Edition 4.6L V8 - gone.
Might be a 2005-2007 Jaguar XJ-8 L in my future.

[email protected]
Westland, Michigan - but I'm from central New Jersey!
http://www.hoodliners.net - My hoodliners I make!
Gonzalo Duque is offline  
post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-18-2010, 10:51 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
I bought a used one from someone on Mark VIII.org years ago. It is a Reinhart chip. (A person whom I despise...) It is "ok", but it turns off the EGR and the secondary O2's and seems to run a little rich on the top end.

But that also might be clogged IMRC secondary ports.

I think it was tuned for a car with more mods than I’m running.

For a chip, I (and most other people on here) recommend Lonnie at Blue Oval Chips (http://www.blueovalchips.com/) (Someone please correct me if this information is no longer correct).

As for the sway bar, I would definitely hold off until you can do the front at the same time!!

The 3.73's and T/L were WELL worth it!!

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-18-2010, 10:56 AM
Listening on 141.850 mHz!
 
Gonzalo Duque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Westland, Michigan
Age: 55
Posts: 829
Thanks for the reply! I will hold off on the bars as they're not up there on the necessary mods yet. I want to do the exhaust, get 18x9 Saleen chrome wheels, then the chip. However I don't know what I want the chip to do, whatever the most common thing to do is what I would want I guess. More HP and more MPG would be ideal. Bigger brakes would be cool too but it stops on a dime right now. Ever so slight squeak from the front. Other than that 93,000 miles and very strong!

I already have 3.27 in the LSC, would going with the 3.73 really make that much more difference? I drive a lot on the Detroit freeways around 80 or so.

ADDED: I also post on the Lincolns of Distinction forum, my LSC was Car of the Month for February and it's in the calendar! I'm hoping my car looks as good as ThomasA's car:




Gonzalo Duque "Gonzo"
1997 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC 4.6L Cobra V8
1997 Thunderbird Limited Edition 4.6L V8 - gone.
Might be a 2005-2007 Jaguar XJ-8 L in my future.

[email protected]
Westland, Michigan - but I'm from central New Jersey!
http://www.hoodliners.net - My hoodliners I make!

Last edited by Gonzalo Duque; 05-18-2010 at 11:08 AM. Reason: ADDED
Gonzalo Duque is offline  
post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-18-2010, 11:55 AM Thread Starter
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Cullman, AL
Age: 56
Posts: 7,758
Send a message via AIM to 94 Daily Driven 4.6L
IMHO, the 3.73's are a good compromise for highway driving vs. acceleration. I also had the 3.27's and I like the 3.73’s. The only drawback I had was getting used to the rpm's being "off" (i.e. higher than I was used to) The first few times I drove with the 3.73's I kept thinking, "Shift already!! Oh wait, I'm already in OD..."

I lost about 1 to 1.5 mpg with the increased rpm (and heavier foot….) On the highway, driving sanely, the mpg didn't decrease too much.

Do a search on here about chips and you can see what is available. Just a “basic chip” is a major improvement to drivability and “seat of the pants” feel.

97 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (Chip'd, 3.73 T/L... so far... )
97 Ford Aspire (Slow, but getting 36 mpg (f'n Ethenol!! )
84 F250 Dually w/6.9L Diesel (7.3L IDI pending)
73 Mercury Cougar Convertible w/351C 4V (Partially Restored)
69 F100 LWB w/460 Engine
76 Glastron Carlson 23' Jet Boat w/460 CJ Engine
94 Daily Driven 4.6L is offline  
post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-19-2010, 08:03 PM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
tbirdtess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western New York
Age: 53
Posts: 2,542
Bar sizes??

Hi

I am in need of the bigger rear bar. Looks like I have a .98" solid bar.
looking for a 1.10 solid or better.

What bar sizes do the Lincolns have?


Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
tbirdtess is offline  
post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 07:47 AM
Heavily Medicated Crime Fighter
 
Mark M. TCCoA VP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1997
Location: Batcave, Wakefield, MA
Posts: 2,073
Send a message via AIM to Mark M. TCCoA VP Send a message via Yahoo to Mark M. TCCoA VP
The 1 1 /4" Addco rear bar is the only large bar to go with the stock front bar. The 1 3/8" rear bar should only go with the 1 3/8" front bar. You will get into problems with tight turns with the 1 3/8" Rear and stock front. Trust me on this one guys as I know a little something about these bars

I happen to have the prototype 1 3/8" F/R bars on the Cat.

"Mark M. TCCoA VP. Emeritus"

To the Batmobile ! ! !

ADDCO MN12 big bar R&D guru
Mark M. TCCoA VP is offline  
post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 08:24 AM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
tbirdtess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western New York
Age: 53
Posts: 2,542
Rear bar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark M. TCCoA VP View Post
The 1 1 /4" Addco rear bar is the only large bar to go with the stock front bar. The 1 3/8" rear bar should only go with the 1 3/8" front bar. You will get into problems with tight turns with the 1 3/8" Rear and stock front. Trust me on this one guys as I know a little something about these bars

I happen to have the prototype 1 3/8" F/R bars on the Cat.
Hello

Well I don't have a stock front bar. I have a 1 3/8 addco bar.

I also don't drive on the street.
I have a little push going into the corner. Good coming out.

If I can't get a bigger bar, I might up the rear springs??

Looking for a solid 1.10 or 1.25 either 1
I seem to have a .98 or 1.00 solid. (90 or 91)


Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
tbirdtess is offline  
post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 08:29 AM
Heavily Medicated Crime Fighter
 
Mark M. TCCoA VP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1997
Location: Batcave, Wakefield, MA
Posts: 2,073
Send a message via AIM to Mark M. TCCoA VP Send a message via Yahoo to Mark M. TCCoA VP
If you have the 1 3/8" front bar why would you want anything smaller in the rear?

"Mark M. TCCoA VP. Emeritus"

To the Batmobile ! ! !

ADDCO MN12 big bar R&D guru
Mark M. TCCoA VP is offline  
post #21 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 09:21 AM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
Traveler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chandler AZ
Age: 56
Posts: 9,165
Garage
Send a message via Yahoo to Traveler
I've got 89 SC bars front and rear... very happy with them, though I might go with a 1.25 bar in the rear someday.


1997 Thunderbird Sport
Low Miles
Wifes Car
destined to remain stock

1997 T-Bird GT 4.6
80 MM Mustang GT MAF - P&P'd Mustang GT TB and Intake Plenum - PI Intake manifold - PI Heads
Mark VIII Torque Converter - J-Modded 4R70W transmission - Mark VIII Aluminum Driveshaft - 3.73 gears
PBR Brake Calipers - Eibach Springs - KYB Shocks
'89 SuperCoupe front and rear sway bars
SCT Chip programmed by Lonnie Doll
255/50/16 Falken Ziex ZE-512's
True Dual exhaust with Magnaflow DI/DO muffler
<<< SOLD >>>
Traveler is offline  
post #22 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 10:11 PM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
tbirdtess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western New York
Age: 53
Posts: 2,542
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark M. TCCoA VP View Post
If you have the 1 3/8" front bar why would you want anything smaller in the rear?
Hi

I started with no rear bar. (old rule)

The car works better with the rear bar!!

looks like I might have to up the rear springs some.


Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
tbirdtess is offline  
post #23 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-25-2010, 02:03 PM
Seasoned PostWhore
 
tbirdtess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Western New York
Age: 53
Posts: 2,542
Lincoln's rear bar sizes????

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbirdtess View Post
Hi

I am in need of the bigger rear bar. Looks like I have a .98" solid bar.
looking for a 1.10 solid or better.

What bar sizes do the Lincolns have?

Anyone know????

Paul [email protected]
1990 Thunderbird Circle Track Street Stock
351W 2bbl.
C-4 Auto
3.90 open rear
tbirdtess is offline  
post #24 of 24 (permalink) Old 05-25-2010, 02:25 PM
PostWhore
The AFDB is on a lil tight.
 
Splattered's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: is hot
Posts: 3,868
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbirdtess View Post
Anyone know????
Lincolns are mostly hollow bars.

Spinning pies like wheels.

DD driving my 20 year old project

Now with new ball joints...again
Splattered is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the TCCoA Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome