for those with addco sway bars...??? - TCCoA Forums
 
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 11:40 AM Thread Starter
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for those with addco sway bars...???

I just ordered a 1 1/4 front and a 1 1/8 rear bar from super coupe performance. I can't wait to get these bad boys in!! Anyway, how does the finish hold up? Any corrosion or rust after a while? I am thinking about either painting or powdercoating, but I'm not sure if it's worth the money and time. So let me know how yours is holding up. Also for those who have replaced both front and rear how did the car feel after? Major difference?

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 12:03 PM
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Why did you order 1 1/8" rear bar to match up with the 1 1/4" front bar? You should have gone with a matched set of the same size otherwise you will end up with the same understeer you have now.

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 12:22 PM Thread Starter
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I don't know about that, do you have any experience with the size bars I'm getting on an mn-12 platform? My reasoning is that the stock rear bar is considerably smaller than the stock front bar and it's hollow. So upgrading the rear to a solid and only having 1/8 diameter in size difference should be well matched. If you put the same size front and rear I think you are more likely to get overseer just because of the simple fact that you have less weight in the rear but the same size bar. From what I've seen, sets that are designed for neutral steering generally have larger bars in front than the rear. But I've never put aftermarket sway bars on an IRS car before so it may behave differently than I'm expecting. Also I ordered from Bill at super coupe performance and I believe this is what's recommended. He only recommended the really large bars for auto-x racing, generally not for daily driving.

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97 Base- Mods: Forged motor, Eaton m112, 2.76 pully, too many mods to list..........
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95BLKLSC
I don't know about that, do you have any experience with the size bars I'm getting on an mn-12 platform?
nah

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Last edited by Sir William; 06-08-2005 at 01:03 PM. Reason: Corrected Mark's QUOTE tag.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 01:03 PM
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Uhhh....Mark did the prototype work on the ADDCO bars. They wouldn't exist without his work and assistance with them. Look at the the bottom of the installation instructions and you'll see his name as the author. I'd think you'd better heed his advice.

On our cars you ALWAYS want either equal or more rear bar. Otherwise, you will NOT be improving your handling enough to warrant the work. The ONLY people I know of who disagree can't handle a car with oversteer. I personally would MUCH rather oversteer than understeer.

What you say about bigger front than rear is true on a solid axle car, but NOT IRS. Our cars need more help in the back to stay flat.

You should at least go with the 1.25" rear if not the 1.375" rear. But what do Mark and I know?

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark M. TCCoA VP
nah
Really? Who the heck stole your name when they wrote these like half a decade ago???

http://www.tccoa.com/articles/suspen...ll/index.shtml
http://www.tccoa.com/articles/suspen...ll/index.shtml


I mean, who in their right mind (and sober) would want to impersonate you anyway?

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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 01:07 PM
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Tell you what, you're in Mass too, why don't you get hold of Mark and go for a ride in his Cat. Between the better bars and big brakes, he can drive it hard enough to hurt you.

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 02:33 PM Thread Starter
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Hey I was just stating what I knew to be true for ever other vehicle I've worked on. With the weight distribution of our cars it just dosen't add up why a larger bar in back is necessary for neutral steering. Does anyone have an actual explanation for this or just opinons? Although like I said I didn't thave any experiance with IRS vehicles as far as sway bars go so don't take what I'm saying the wrong way, I'm just the type of person that needs facts. I had no idea Mark was a key player in the prototype, why didn't you speak up Mark? I'm always intrested in what other guys think and have had experance with, so thanks for the input. Although I hope you guys are wrong becuase then I will have to buy another bar!! Well everything is already ordered and on it's way. I'll install and then report back how the steering feels as far as understeer/oversteer, then I'll take it from there.

95 LSC- Mods: 2.5 dual exhaust, 3.73s, 17x9 cobra R Rims, SCT dyno tune, MM driveshaft, 249 rwhp/ 268 ft lb tq
97 Base- Mods: Forged motor, Eaton m112, 2.76 pully, too many mods to list..........
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 03:25 PM
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Hi,

Below is a post from a few years ago on the LOD site.

MN12 Anti Sway Bars 101"


Hello All,

Since there have been a number of posts as of late regarding the ADDCO large bars I thought some of you would like to know the history of these MN12 large anti sway bars.


Approximately four years ago I contacted ADDCO Industries regarding anti sway bars for my 93 XR-7 and other MN12s. I found the only bar available through ADDCO was a 1 1/8" rear bar upgrade and that it was a solid steel bar unlike my stock 15/16" hollow bar. I ordered The bar upgrade and after the installation I was impressed with the difference in handling. After putting the suspension through its paces on the street I found the car still had a substantial amount of understeer present. For those of you that don't know, Automobile Manufacturers purposely build a good amount of understeer into the suspension system to make the car's handling more predictable for the general public.

Having an engineering background myself I contacted the lead engineer at ADDCO to discuss the possibly of a larger rear bar. I was then informed that they had looked at making a larger rear bar but the stock frame to bar bracket would not accept a larger bar than their 1 1/8"bar. After promising ADDCO I would do all I could to find a simple way of mounting a larger bar ADDCO bent me up a 1 1/4" prototype bar. As it turned out all that was necessary was the stock bracket needed to be spread open just a bit to allow room for the 1 1/4" poly bushing. Handling was greatly enhanced with this upgrade and was far more neutral. ADDCO decided to manufacture these 1 1/4" bars and make them available exclusively to TCCoA members for as least one year. Many many upgrade kits were sold to club members and the response was overwhelmingly positive. ADDCO was very pleased with the sales of this new bar. My direction then turned to upgrading the 1.1" stock front bar. It turned out ADDCO had at one time looked at the possibility of making a front bar but the captured design of the MN12 front end was the recipe for an installation nightmare. ADDCO agreed to send me a prototype 1 1/4" front bar to test the feasibility of an install.

I first started out with the Ford Manual and after many hours I did manage to remove the stock front bar only to find out there was no way in hell a larger bar was going to go back in the same way the old stock bar came out due to the new bars larger diameter and its bend radiuses. Basically you have to corkscrew the old bar out the right fender well. I then had to stop and take a fresh look at the front suspension system to find another way to do this install and after much work I found a way to do it with spacer plates and collars.

Handling was incredible with the 1 1/4" F/R bars to say the least. It turns out that a truly balanced MN12 works best with a matched sized front and rear sway bar combo. About this time I was contacted by ADDCO and they informed me that they had come up with a new poly bushing for the rear 1 1/4" bar that did not require any modification to the stock bracket. This new poly bushing had a thinner wall thickness. At that point a little light went on in my head. Since I already found a way to open up the rear stock brackets and the 1 1/4" bars worked out so well then why not see if the limits could be pushed with the addition of 1 3/8" F/R bars using a thinner walled 1 3/8" bushing. ADDCO thought I was loosing my mind but agreed to bend me up a set of 1 3/8" bars. Handling was even better than with the 1 1/4" bars but some added stiffness was also present itself. I felt the slot car like handling with the big bars more than made up for a slightly stiffer ride. The ride in my opinion is very acceptable. This ends my little anti sway bar story. Please follow the links below for more info on handling.

Regards

Mark McCormack
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 04:23 PM
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Suspension was the first major improvement I tackled when I decided to do the car up right. Knowing there was a sway bar upgrade and a spring/shock combo was the deciding factor. Long story short, Any owner of a 89- 97 MN-12 that has not had the suspension gone over is just beginning the journey. Suspension is where you start. Having a nice handling car is where you end up.
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 07:45 PM
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-08-2005, 08:39 PM Thread Starter
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Mark, thanks for the write up! Really appreciated man, it's nice to know the background of how the loarger bars came to be. I'd love to take a ride in your car sometime. For now I'm going to try the 1 1/8 because it's already on it's way here. I'll see if it's good enough for what I want, if not I'll upgrade. I'm not looking for an auto-x car, it's a dayly driver that I like to perform good.

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97 Base- Mods: Forged motor, Eaton m112, 2.76 pully, too many mods to list..........
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-10-2005, 09:53 AM
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"slot car like" is definitely an accurate description for a car with the big bars and JL's bracing (never drove my car with just the big bars, did the bracing at the same time)

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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-13-2005, 01:04 AM
 
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1 3/8" F&R bars

I have the F&R 1 3/8" bars on my '89 XR-7. I love'em!!!!! I don't think the ride is harsh at all. The OEM XR-7 suspension is stiffer than the SC's. The "Big Bars" do make the ride stiffer, but not extremely. The stock SC rear bar was Very Violent when it unloaded after hangin' the rear end out. So violent in fact, that the sway bar would actually throw the car into the opposite lane. With the big bars, I can still hang the rear end out, but only when I try to. Then the car nicely steps back in line. No more expected lane changes!!!!! The car is a daily summer car & handles like it's on rails.

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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 06-13-2005, 12:47 PM
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Thanks for the thumbs up guys

I have had every combo on my car and the 1 3/8" setup is there to stay. I live in MA. the pothole capital of the country and it is not that bad at all.

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