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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 09-30-2006, 09:13 AM Thread Starter
 
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Camber kit?

I took my T-Bird in this morning to have the tires rotated an balanced, which I do about every three months, and to have one repaired due to nail.

They showed me the front tires had teh inner shoulder really worn down. The rears showed it too just not to that extream.

The car has Eibach springs, put on last year, and Bilstein shocks. The tires are Kumho Ectsa 711s on 17" T-Bird Cobra wheels. The tires and wheels were put on around this time last year. The front upper and lower control arms were replaced around the same time too.

I have the Firestone Life time alignment and had been taking it in every three months to have the alignment done.

The guys at Discount Tire this morning suggested getting a Camber Kit to take care of the problem.

Anybody have any experience with these and know where to get one? HOw much are they? Any suggestions on other possible causes?

I appreciate the help.
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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 09-30-2006, 11:55 AM
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camber kits dont exist for these cars....they just dont know how to align your car. Find an actual alignment shop to do it. There is plenty of adjustment space between both the camber bolt and the strut rod adjustments.....the guy who told you to get a camber kit is wha i would call...."an assclown".




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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 09-30-2006, 07:43 PM
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I have heard that term before also. They say the "kit" has a cam'd bolt. Our bolt is already cam'd.

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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 09-30-2006, 10:32 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Great Obucina
camber kits dont exist for these cars....they just dont know how to align your car. Find an actual alignment shop to do it. There is plenty of adjustment space between both the camber bolt and the strut rod adjustments.....the guy who told you to get a camber kit is wha i would call...."an assclown".


Thanks for the replies.
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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-01-2006, 11:19 AM
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I had to go to Four alignment shops before I'd find one that would align my car. As soon as they heard the phrase "lowering springs" they said no. Finally the local GM dealer said no problem and did a good job at all four corners. I may have to head back and have it looked at again. Its been about a year, and I have bigger tires now.


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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-01-2006, 05:50 PM Thread Starter
 
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I dont know why but my car has always worn tires fast.

We bought it new and it had a pronounced pull to one side. The dealership blamed the Firestone tires. After much haggling witht he Firestone place, tehy finally gave me a price break on a new pair.

But, whether normal height or lowered it seems to wear out tires faster than it should. I dont drive agresssively or spin the tires. I align and balance regularly. In fact since July of last year, this makes the fifth time.

So I am at a loss to explain this.

Any theories?
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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-02-2006, 07:43 AM
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I've always just had Firestone and the lifetime alignment. But now that I've moved and neither car is covered (never got around to the 5.0 and the SC anit needed it yet) I'm going to be in the same boat shortly.

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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-03-2006, 10:47 PM Thread Starter
 
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Dont know if it would help, but I scanned in the before and after specs and posted it here:

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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-04-2006, 01:35 AM
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seriously consider takin it to a dealer for an alignment.. one time fee of $40.. then you have the specs you need to carry with you when you go to the firestone shop can't argue with what the dealer set it as


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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-04-2006, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gzj14v
Dont know if it would help, but I scanned in the before and after specs and posted it here:


If you go back to that Firestone for an alignment, be sure and have someone else do it. That "not adjustable" note about the rear camber is very incorrect. I had a debate with the the guy that did my last alignment about that. I ended up having to get under the car myself and show him. There is an eccentric bolt located on the frame side of the rear upper control arm that will let you adjust the rear camber.

Sold = 96 Thunderbird
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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-04-2006, 06:37 PM
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Last time I took one of my MN12's in for an alignment, the shop tried to pull the same crap on me....so I climbed under the car and showed the guy how to set up the alignment. I'd do it myself if I had all the cool alignment gear.

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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-04-2006, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racecougar
I'd do it myself if I had all the cool alignment gear.


I did an alignment myself once after doing some suspension work just to get it close before I took it to get aligned. I used some string and a carpenters square like 392Bird described a while back, and I did a pretty good job. I told the guy who did my alignment how I did it and he was shocked how close I got it.

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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-04-2006, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron K.


I did an alignment myself once after doing some suspension work just to get it close before I took it to get aligned. I used some string and a carpenters square like 392Bird described a while back, and I did a pretty good job. I told the guy who did my alignment how I did it and he was shocked how close I got it.
I've done the same, but while the results are close, they aren't as accurate as what you'll get with the "pro" equipment.

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-05-2006, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racecougar
I've done the same, but while the results are close, they aren't as accurate as what you'll get with the "pro" equipment.

-Rod
I had to do the same to adjust the rear camber and toe on my right rear wheel after an alignment shop screwed up that wheel. I had one front upper control arm out on my other car and reinstalled it using sting and sight. 50 or so thousand miles later, the car still drives great and wears tires very well. Much depends on the skills of the individual in question.

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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-05-2006, 12:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racecougar
I've done the same, but while the results are close, they aren't as accurate as what you'll get with the "pro" equipment.

-Rod
the shop I use, which is the one aaron happens to hate, uses some old skule equipment and gets the front end spot on everytime. The guy who does my car does it everytime i come in. Weber is the only shop ive been to that actually adjusts the strut rod. All the other grease monkies used to crank on the camber bolt till the green lights flashed.




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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-05-2006, 08:12 AM
 
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I adjusted my front alignment perfectly with a tape measure and a bubble type caster/camber gauge. The gauge is one that centers on the spindle after removing the dust cap and stays in place with a magnet. A $50,000 alignment rack is only as good as the goofball setting it up, so odds are my bubble gauge is better 90% of the time. The front tires still look new a year later but the rears are almost bald
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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-22-2006, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
 
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Finally took the car into a Ford dealership and had them check teh alignment.

They said everything was within specs but made a few minor adjustments including towing out the front tires just a smidge.

http://www.dropshots.com/day.php?use...2&ctime=095011

Still sucks that I need to get new tires in just a year though.
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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-24-2006, 03:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icantdrive55
I adjusted my front alignment perfectly with a tape measure and a bubble type caster/camber gauge. The gauge is one that centers on the spindle after removing the dust cap and stays in place with a magnet. A $50,000 alignment rack is only as good as the goofball setting it up, so odds are my bubble gauge is better 90% of the time. The front tires still look new a year later but the rears are almost bald
I'm a level 3 auto technician (alignment/suspension/brake) for Sears and used to work at a dealership. The idiots they let do alignments really scares me. With the newer machines you have to ignore the directions to mis-align a vehicle and then it won't let you sign off as done. Yes the newer machines actually show you how to do every step of the alignment (with videos, suggested tools, and audio aids). The old bubble type gauges do still work, but I would never use them on my vehicles. I use a Hunter DSP-600 (wireless laser compensated) and matching Hunter 24,000lb x-long four post rack, that's about a $95,000 dollar machine after proper installation and leveling. I have never had a comeback on an alignment besides a yearly checkup. I aligned mine after lowering it 3" all around and installing a staggered 17/18 combo and check it every 3 months. It is still in perfect spec, the same spec that Ford has for it. Our machine is maintained and updated anually (so that we have the same specs as the dealerships). If someone tells you you need a camber kit for a vehicle that is factory adjustable (all they have to do is enter it in the machine and it will tell them) it's time to go somewhere else. Somewhere that knows what they're doing. Sorry for the rant but I have had to fix alot of fubared alignments that other people have screwed up lately at the other shops in town.

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Last edited by moore89; 10-24-2006 at 03:52 AM.
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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 10-24-2006, 03:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gzj14v
Finally took the car into a Ford dealership and had them check teh alignment.

They said everything was within specs but made a few minor adjustments including towing out the front tires just a smidge.

http://www.dropshots.com/day.php?use...2&ctime=095011

Still sucks that I need to get new tires in just a year though.
It looks like your front tires still have a good amount of negative camber (camber and toe are the big destroyers of tires). They do show to be in the specified range of -1.3 to 0.3 but still negative. If they are using a DSP-300 or newer their machine should have a half tollerance setting that when applied will make that range 1/2 of what it is now. My front tires are at 0.01 and 0.02 for camber and 0.02 both sides for toe. I usually use half tollerance unless I'm working on a f350 or something heavy duty.

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Last edited by moore89; 10-24-2006 at 03:53 AM.
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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 01:11 PM
 
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i am running into the same thing guys. this guy was very knowledgable and showed me there was no adjustment left and i still had crazy negative camber left. he also asked if i knew is someone made a cambe kits. i have taken it to two shops now and the second one was very reputable and alll they do is suspension stuff. so what do i do to help fix my problem with not being able to be aligned. i also hav ethe eibach kit
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post #21 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 01:25 PM
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i believe the slotted hole for the bolt has a little more room left in it even after the eccentric is maxed out. i would maybe think about grinding the eccentic down to get that arm a little further inward. just a thought. someone else had mentioned this a while ago somewhere.

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post #22 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 02:34 PM
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I cut my eibach springs and my alignment is still only a half degree out of acceptable range...with around 3 inches of drop. If you replaced all your suspension stuff, something else is wrong. has your car ever been in an accident? or maybe something happened before you got it.
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post #23 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 04:01 PM Thread Starter
 
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I wound up going to a Mercury dealership. They aligned it without any problems. (See previous posts above.)
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post #24 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moore89 View Post
I'm a level 3 auto technician (alignment/suspension/brake) for Sears and used to work at a dealership. The idiots they let do alignments really scares me. With the newer machines you have to ignore the directions to mis-align a vehicle and then it won't let you sign off as done. Yes the newer machines actually show you how to do every step of the alignment (with videos, suggested tools, and audio aids). The old bubble type gauges do still work, but I would never use them on my vehicles. I use a Hunter DSP-600 (wireless laser compensated) and matching Hunter 24,000lb x-long four post rack, that's about a $95,000 dollar machine after proper installation and leveling. I have never had a comeback on an alignment besides a yearly checkup. I aligned mine after lowering it 3" all around and installing a staggered 17/18 combo and check it every 3 months. It is still in perfect spec, the same spec that Ford has for it. Our machine is maintained and updated anually (so that we have the same specs as the dealerships). If someone tells you you need a camber kit for a vehicle that is factory adjustable (all they have to do is enter it in the machine and it will tell them) it's time to go somewhere else. Somewhere that knows what they're doing. Sorry for the rant but I have had to fix alot of fubared alignments that other people have screwed up lately at the other shops in town.
Sounds like I may have to look into a trip to Enid! What does your shop charge for a 4 wheel alignment? I'll need one once I get the Eibachs installed. (well, re-installed. Off of the LE and onto the LX)


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post #25 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-20-2007, 04:29 PM
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The shop (small Shop) used a long stick and spray paint .

He did a better job then the computerized shop I first took it to and charged me 35.00 .

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post #26 of 26 (permalink) Old 02-21-2007, 09:09 PM
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Sounds like I may have to look into a trip to Enid! What does your shop charge for a 4 wheel alignment? I'll need one once I get the Eibachs installed. (well, re-installed. Off of the LE and onto the LX)
They charge $64.99 for an alignment, but I don't work there anymore so I don't know how good the work quality is now. I know the other tech 3 there and he's not really a perfectionist. If anyone was curious mine has a 3" drop via springs (jamex) and all new suspension components, paired with a staggered set of 17x9's 245/45's and 18x10's 275/40's. Oh and on a side note My 35th got a face lift thanks to a un-yeilding Honda Accord a few months ago. But the alignment is still good , just took out the bumper, hood, LF fender and bumper support (totaled it got 3K for it bought it back for $60) currently being rebuilt.

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1967 Ford F100 2WD (460 bored .060 over, too much cam and gearing for the street).
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