4.6 help please engine? drivetrain? both banks lean but drinks gas, o/d light blinkin - TCCoA Forums
 
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post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-01-2002, 12:38 AM Thread Starter
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yeah thats what my mechanic said " its the O2 sensors". i priced a pair at kregan for a little over $100. thats probably it I hope. and why would one plug be white and the other black?
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post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-01-2010, 07:23 PM
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4.6 help please engine? drivetrain? both banks lean but drinks gas, o/d light blinkin

Ok so im getting these p0171 and p0174 codes for banks one and two both being lean since ive replace my transmission and torque converter since the converter went out. Ive changed the O2 sensors and the Idle air control recently due to other problems in the past. So now my car is drinking major gas like twice the usual but it says its lean. Also I believe I heard some pinging from my driver side like it was from detonation. So I put in a new maf, some 93, reset the codes, and it still came up after a few minutes of driving, but it doesn’t drink gas as bad and runs better even with 87.

Also before I replaced the transmission it idled fine in park/neutral start up goes straight to a little over 1000 and work its way down to around 1000 but when I shifted into reverse/drive the rpms would drop extremely low the car would shudder and stall.
Now it starts up goes to above 1000 but then immediately drops down to around 500-700 and then works its way up to 1000 and when I shift into drive/reverse and remain at a stop the needle goes to 500 bounces on that line, kinda looks like a rock skipping on water, and every 8-10 seconds or so drops to like 400-350 like it wants to stall but doesn’t. Then it takes forever to shift through first and second sound extremely loud like im putting the pedal to the floor and it seems like I have to hold the pedal down farther and harder when I want the car to shift like it doesn’t want to when it gets to third seems like it runs more like normal


Also since ive replaced the tranny and converter the o/d light blinks occasionally and randomly. The speedo doesn’t work in first at all, it says like 30 when I know im going around over 50 when in second, third is ok it seems but unstable, and fourth says im going faster than I think I am like it says 90 on the interstate when the speed limit is 60 so everyones going no more than 80.


The transmission I put in came out of the same year 96 4.6 thunderbird so I don’t think it’s a tranny electronic connection problem

And it has a new iac, maf, o2 sensors, but still says both sides lean
I CANNOT find a vacuum leak replaced most of the vacuum lines also

Someone please help me and yea ive searched
i saw the one "97 4.6 engine trans problem or maybe both"
and all the ones talking about lean conditions and the codes "Codes P0171 & P0174 "
i dont know what to do now
sorry if posted in wrong section or too many problems for one thread
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post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-01-2010, 08:45 PM
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Clean your MAF. Search the forums for the how-to. Also the o/d light is probly something due to the install maybe?

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post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-01-2010, 09:02 PM
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i cleaned the maf
then replaced it
it helped like after i first reset the codes it runs pretty good
but gets worst again over time
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post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-01-2010, 09:58 PM
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does anyone have any other ideas
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post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 12:14 AM
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either vacuum leak you haven't found or fuel pressure regulator problem is my initial guess.....maybe the O2 wires are damaged........since you've replaced several items you'll need to log the data from the pcm IF it turns out that there is in fact no vacuum leak
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post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 10:06 AM
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Ive changed the O2 sensors and the Idle air control recently due to other problems in the past. So now my car is drinking major gas like twice the usual but it says its lean.
I'm not sure but maybe it's the IAC? Did you get a cheapie from a parts store? I just replaced mine with one from Auto Zone while I was replacing my DPFE sensor on my 95 and took a road trip and used a lot more gas than normal. I did notice on the cheapie, it doesn't have a spring on the rod inside it and the OEM does. I'm not getting any codes though but now you've got me wondering

Mike

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post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 10:33 AM
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Timing can cause major gas usage!! I know on an intrepid i had Timing was off a lil and it started using twice the gas almost!!

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post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 11:28 AM
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does anyone have any other ideas
YEAH - Have Tranny guy pull the Tranny Codes also per the blinking OD lite.

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The transmission I put in came out of the same year 96 4.6 thunderbird so I don’t think it’s a tranny electronic connection problem
WRONG thinking... Your Speedo probs clearly indicate one of possibly SEVERAL probs related to an install prob with internal or external Tranny harness or electrical Tranny component.

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post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
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YEAH - Have Tranny guy pull the Tranny Codes also per the blinking OD lite.



WRONG thinking... Your Speedo probs clearly indicate one of possibly SEVERAL probs related to an install prob with internal or external Tranny harness or electrical Tranny component.
Exactly....they probably just told him it came out of the same year car just to make the sale....more than likely came out of a mustang with perhaps even with a different speedo gear
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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 01:27 PM
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Drop the pan on the tranny and look at the solenoids; that's pretty clear.

Or, you could just look at the tag on the passenger side of the tranny and post what it says.

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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-02-2010, 04:00 PM
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You were getting these codes ever since the trans was replaced, right?

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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 02:39 PM
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Exactly....they probably just told him it came out of the same year car just to make the sale....more than likely came out of a mustang with perhaps even with a different speedo gear

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YEAH - Have Tranny guy pull the Tranny Codes also per the blinking OD lite.



WRONG thinking... Your Speedo probs clearly indicate one of possibly SEVERAL probs related to an install prob with internal or external Tranny harness or electrical Tranny component.

no it came out of an exact same style thunderbird that i put it in now they look exactly the same, same headlights, hoods, side panels on the doors, intake manifolds, same 96 sport rims, they are exactly the same
i wrecked the first thunderbird and pulled the engine and transmission myself they are both 96 4.6
i didnt buy the engine or transmission i already had it sitting in my garage i knew i was going to get another thunderbird

then might the tranny be internally damaged due to the wreck
and do i have to have the green light blinking to get the codes

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You were getting these codes ever since the trans was replaced, right?
yea maybe even before beacuse i had an evap canister code that would come on and off but it hasnt popped up since the tranny swap



and for the engine i should check timing, fuel pump+fuel pressure regulator?
what about injectors?

someone told me it could possibly be the catalytic converters is that true?

Last edited by msp252; 01-03-2010 at 02:45 PM. Reason: grammar +detail
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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 02:49 PM
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I'm sure you know that only the fancy Code Readers the Tranny guys or Ford has can read the Tranny Codes - Our Readers can't pull them - Before tearing into it I would have it read when O/D lite is blinking - My guess is replacement Tranny or your electrical installation of Tranny Harness has some "issues".

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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 04:01 PM
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I'd bet that the shop that did your trans swap is the problem. Bring it back to them and tell them to fix the car.

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post #16 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 04:21 PM
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i did the tranny swap myself
in my driveway
a shop cost way too much

i think im about to take all the electronics from the old tranny and put it on this one

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post #17 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 04:29 PM
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I'm sure you know that only the fancy Code Readers the Tranny guys or Ford has can read the Tranny Codes - Our Readers can't pull them - Before tearing into it I would have it read when O/D lite is blinking - My guess is replacement Tranny or your electrical installation of Tranny Harness has some "issues".
i think thats what it is too
but the only thing i can think of is internal damage from the wreck or the connections are messed up
everything hooked up no problem i shouldnt have to repin the connectors


does anyone think not putting the driveshaft in exactly as it came out would affect things
because when i did it i marked it or tried to and pretty sure it went back in exactly the same but would issues arise if i didnt

Last edited by msp252; 01-03-2010 at 04:32 PM. Reason: clarification
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post #18 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 05:43 PM
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post #19 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 06:48 PM
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Will an Xcal2 read tranny codes, while we are close to the subject?

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
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post #20 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 09:22 PM
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I'm sure you know that only the fancy Code Readers the Tranny guys or Ford has can read the Tranny Codes - Our Readers can't pull them - Before tearing into it I would have it read when O/D lite is blinking - My guess is replacement Tranny or your electrical installation of Tranny Harness has some "issues".
not true. I had an O/d Blinking light once, the cod was due to high fluid temp, but is actually a bad sensor because the high fluid temp was showing up when it was -10 and cold started. went away when warm.

Anyway, I took the car to Mr Transmission and had them read the codes as per the same advice given above. I took it home, and borrowed my dads code reader, a CAN OBDII reader. it also read the same code just fine.

I don't know about ABS codes, but I was able to pull transmission codes with a regular scanner.
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post #21 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-03-2010, 10:17 PM
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not true. I had an O/d Blinking light once, Anyway, I took the car to Mr Transmission and had them read the codes as per the same advice given above. I took it home, and borrowed my dads code reader, a CAN OBDII reader. it also read the same code just fine. I don't know about ABS codes, but I was able to pull transmission codes with a regular scanner.
Interesting - I have NO doubt whatsoever there are exceptions - But Thread Starter is only getting "p0171 and p0174 codes for banks one and two" & Thread Starter has blinking OD Lite so Thread Starter has some Tranny Codes HIS Code Reader will not pull - My Innova won;t pull ABS Codes either but car is 96 so I think some changes happened over the years - Even yours was a 97.

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post #22 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-04-2010, 06:35 AM
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actually I was pulling codes on a 96. don't have any yet on the 97.

I read the same thing, that's why I was curious and took it to a trans shop first, then did the test with the CanOBDII.

my dad now has a different one, it was REALLY cheap, like $29 or something. I haven't had any tranny codes so I may never get to test that cheapo, but I know a CanOBDII will read tranny codes on a 96
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post #23 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-04-2010, 02:36 PM
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when it first happened it only blinked at the end of the shifts and it would seem like the overdrive went out and it had to go to higher rpms for it to shift thus me pressing down further and longer on the gas pedals

then it started doing it only through second
and sometimes after i drove it for a while in idle

now its random
if i let it sit and its cold as soon as i drive a little ways down the street it starts blinking till it shifts to the next gear

changing the maf helped also
i also have an oil leak somewhere on the front driver side in the middle somewhere and it drips down the whole front and all under the car and oil pan to the tranny

and the tranny is leaking tranny fruid from around the dipstick area
but both the leaks do not leak that bad

also i do believe the engine runs hot because sometimes when i drive for long distances i can feel heat around my legs with no heat or a/c on at all and windows up or down

and it definatley runs hotter than the other 4.6 96 thunderbird i had

i get autozone to check the engine light for me and if the light has to be blinking for the reader to pick up the codes thats why they werent pulled because the light only blinks when the car is running autozone never want me to start up the car

and the light rarely blinks when the car isnt moving

but i do get the 1 + 2 bank lean codes and have already changed the maf, iac, and, o2 sensors
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post #24 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-04-2010, 04:11 PM
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Will an Xcal2 read tranny codes, while we are close to the subject?
yes

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post #25 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-04-2010, 06:09 PM
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but i do get the 1 + 2 bank lean codes and have already changed the maf, iac, and, o2 sensors
assuming those items are running as they should, you have a vacuum leak or exhaust leak...both can cause lean codes, but the exhaust leaks will cause false lean codes which can trigger the computer to dump in fuel when in fact it shouldnt
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post #26 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-06-2010, 09:19 PM
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exhaust leak will cause a false code

well i definatley might have one of those

my y pipe that come off the manifolds to the two catayltic converters
only has one bolt on each side connecting it to the manifolds and after that y pipe and the cats the rest of my exhaust is not even there

so that might be causing these codes
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post #27 of 28 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 07:48 PM Thread Starter
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just got mine scanned and i have the same problems, CEL and blinking O/D. luckly im taking auto right now and my instructor let me use his $4K snap-on scanner and it threw these codes. P1407- no EGR flow, P0171- lean bank 1, P0174- lean bank 2, P1731- 1-2 shift fault, should i worry about the EGR? my instructor said to change the fuel filter for starters. but kinda puzzled about the tranny code, damn B&M!
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post #28 of 28 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 08:20 PM
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sounds similar to the way my car ran and mine was bad o2 sensors...my aeroforce interceptor scanguage reads trans codes


have you pulled the plugs? i had black plugs out of one bank and white out of the other

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