5.4 4v going in - TCCoA Forums
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post #1 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-16-2013, 11:44 PM Thread Starter
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5.4 4v going in

Any advice would be appreciated. I've got a 97tird with the 4.6 and a 5.4 4v from a Navigator is going in with a Sullivan Intake. My question is what can be done about the computer and harness besides running a F.A.S.T system. Also has anyone tried the Sanderson 4v headers in these type cars. Going to try to attach pictures of progress, motor is already out and powdercoating is done on the intake and valve/coil covers. I found a good guy at Precision Mustang Performance in Forney, Tx. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...ize=1280%2C960
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post #2 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 12:01 AM
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oohhh another one...


what exactly do you mean "what can be done about the computer"? what's wrong with yours? Do you not know how to make it work? Or is there something specific troubling your install with it?

BTW, any response for this Q from your previous thread?: http://forums.tccoa.com/showpost.php...29&postcount=8

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post #3 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 12:55 AM
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Your stock computer should be able to be tuned for this motor.

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post #4 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 04:52 AM
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You do understand what has to be done to get this motor to fit right?

http://forums.tccoa.com/showthread.php?t=137650

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post #5 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 05:22 AM
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And I don't think firescout211 ever finished. Last I heard he was supposedly building up that thing with a Vortech etc. but a few weeks ago he was selling one off. Hmmm... makes you wonder....

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post #6 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 08:42 AM Thread Starter
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Maestro sorry for the late response. The first guy I had helping me was a crook and got me to buy alot of parts I didn't need. I know I need to use the oil pan from 4.6 and some of the baffles have to be bent or removed, and spacers put on the engine mounts. I will know in a few days if I can use the Sanderson headers or just use some stock ones, I will be adding a turbo down the road so stock/log headers would be fine to. Can my stock computer work running the individuals coils already on the 4v or do I have to use the coil packs and fab up new brackets to hold them. Pretty sure I will have to use a brake booster from an earlier bird so it will fit without denting it. I've waited over four years now trying to find a shop in the DFW area that didnt want my first born to help me out with this swap.
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post #7 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 08:48 AM
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Talk to Sik97Bird. He's a mechanic and a Tbird guy and can help you. He's up in Frisco.

You can send him a PM. I'll contact him and see if I can pass his number along to you.

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post #8 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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I got this motor for $400 and upon tear down it looks like it was hardly driven. I also have the last sullivan intake with the water cross over already in it.

Thanks Monkey. If he's in Frisco he probably knows my guy, he was at Dallas Mustang and opened his own shop a while back.

Last edited by Trunk Monkey; 05-17-2013 at 09:07 AM. Reason: Merge posts
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post #9 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 09:12 AM
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The Sullivan works great at 7000rpm, but like crap below that. The stock cams will not work well with the Sullivan as they are spec'd for power below 4000rpm. You will not find headers to fit and without headers the power will be terrible. The stock computer will drive the COPs so you must use the 4.6 ignition setup.

The best intake manifold options are the cobra/mach intakes with adapters as they will make power where it needs to be made.

Also, there will be some fitment issues...well many issues actually.
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post #10 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 09:29 AM Thread Starter
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Cam swap and bottom end rebuild will be done further down the road, we just want it running down the road first then worry about making big steam later. Any other fitment issues other than the ones I've listed. I know headers are an issue thats why I asked if anyone had tried the Sanderson headers they are "block huggers" for a '32 with a 4v swap.
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post #11 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 10:06 AM
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Did you look at the thread white 97 lx linked to? Frame rails, shock towers, and a hood to name a few...

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post #12 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 10:28 AM Thread Starter
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Yes I looked at that and he was using kooks, I havent said anything about the kooks headers tha'ts why I was asking about the Sanderson headers. The shock towers were'nt cut originally on that thread and supercoupeperformance.com has a hood that will work
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post #13 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buchsbird View Post
YThe shock towers were'nt cut originally on that thread
Yes, they were. Have a closer look.

http://forums.tccoa.com/showpost.php...3&postcount=63

That is the car that was "running" with the 5.4 32v. The transplant car does not run, and the photos presented are mockup and fitment tests only.

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post #14 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 11:40 AM
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Yes, they were. Have a closer look.

http://forums.tccoa.com/showpost.php...3&postcount=63

That is the car that was "running" with the 5.4 32v. The transplant car does not run, and the photos presented are mockup and fitment tests only.
i didn't notice before, but it looks like they welded the k-member to the front subframe as well......WOW.

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post #15 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buchsbird View Post
Maestro sorry for the late response. The first guy I had helping me was a crook and got me to buy alot of parts I didn't need. I know I need to use the oil pan from 4.6 and some of the baffles have to be bent or removed, and spacers put on the engine mounts. I will know in a few days if I can use the Sanderson headers or just use some stock ones, I will be adding a turbo down the road so stock/log headers would be fine to. Can my stock computer work running the individuals coils already on the 4v or do I have to use the coil packs and fab up new brackets to hold them. Pretty sure I will have to use a brake booster from an earlier bird so it will fit without denting it. I've waited over four years now trying to find a shop in the DFW area that didnt want my first born to help me out with this swap.
Your stock computer can fire COP coils in the same way I did that write up nearly 8 yes ago. Search for it. Or you can use spark plug wires, its up to you.

4 years trying to find a shop? You could have learned how to cut/fabricate/weld steel yourself in four years in you were serious......
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post #16 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 04:18 PM Thread Starter
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Your stock computer can fire COP coils in the same way I did that write up nearly 8 yes ago. Search for it. Or you can use spark plug wires, its up to you.

4 years trying to find a shop? You could have learned how to cut/fabricate/weld steel yourself in four years in you were serious......
Yes I could have learned but that would mean the wife doesnt park in the garage, and happy wife happy life. The guy that was supposed to do the swap for me never did anything, when I had remodeled his bathroom and a bunch of other stuff in trade for his labor. I'm thrilled with the guys at Precision doing the work. Oil pan from the 4.6 modified to go on the 5.4 today and test fitting the motor will happen shortly. Cutting the shock towers I can deal with, but I wont cut the frame rails.
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post #17 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 04:22 PM
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I wont cut the frame rails.
I think you're the most sane person to attempt this swap yet.

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post #18 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buchsbird View Post
Yes I could have learned but that would mean the wife doesnt park in the garage, and happy wife happy life. The guy that was supposed to do the swap for me never did anything, when I had remodeled his bathroom and a bunch of other stuff in trade for his labor. I'm thrilled with the guys at Precision doing the work. Oil pan from the 4.6 modified to go on the 5.4 today and test fitting the motor will happen shortly. Cutting the shock towers I can deal with, but I wont cut the frame rails.
You don't need a garage to learn that stuff. I don't got a garage. Either way, good luck man.
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post #19 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 05:10 PM
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I think you're the most sane person to attempt this swap yet.
The frame rail hackage is purely because people keep trying to run kooks which are almost too wide for a 4.6 car. Manifolds or modified Mustang headers would probably do much better to alleviate clearance issues since they hug the engine better. 5.4 2Vs prove this as the heads are no wider on the exhaust side and those fit ok in multiple running vehicles

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post #20 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 05:40 PM Thread Starter
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It looks like the tower was cut as part of the frame cutting, but we will know soon if it will fit without cutting or not.....



Found those threads Maestro, thanks. That will save a lot of time.

Last edited by Trunk Monkey; 01-12-2014 at 10:04 AM. Reason: Merge posts, embed photo
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post #21 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 06:42 PM
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Not a chance of those fitting properly (aka without fab work).

Last edited by guitar maestro; 05-18-2013 at 08:59 AM.
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post #22 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 08:32 PM
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Not a chance of those fitting properly (aka without fab work).
The left side is going to drill the steering shaft as well.

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post #23 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 08:36 PM
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The steering shaft accommodation is the least of the issues with those headers.
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post #24 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 09:08 PM
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There's really only one way to avoid cutting critical body structure and run headers and that is to either buy something close to fitting and fabricate or fabricate from scratch. Nothing off the shelf will fit.

IMO 03 Cobra manifolds with the steering shaft mod would likely be the closest bolt in option you've got. They give much better clearance than tubular headers, flow very well and although you won't have great scavenging with them, you won't with the shorties you posted either.

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post #25 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 09:45 PM Thread Starter
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Got it thanks guys, gotta handle one issue at a time.
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post #26 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-17-2013, 11:55 PM
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can I be slightly abrasive with this one? Ok, cool, thanks.

Ever see those SNL parodies of George HW Bush and not raising taxes? "Not gonna do it". This is how the 5.4 4v will go. While it may seem like a cool, rare thing...its going to hit a brick wall and hit one hard. Think of the crash test videos of the Smart Car, but unsuccessful.




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post #27 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-18-2013, 08:08 AM Thread Starter
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Nobody said anything about politics so lets stop that B.S. now. If you have advice that would be greatly appreciated, otherwise sssshhhhhhhhhhh.
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post #28 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-18-2013, 08:46 AM
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post #29 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-18-2013, 08:55 AM
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post #30 of 188 (permalink) Old 05-18-2013, 09:03 AM
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That's a SOHC,....anybody can do that!
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