Well there goes my 4v engine! - TCCoA Forums
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post #1 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 03:12 AM Thread Starter
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Well there goes my 4v engine!

On my way home from work last night I went at it with this 3v S197 mustang. First gear car ran like a bat outta hell, hit second and barked the tires and then the car just fell on its face. Horrible misfire and smoking like a train, had to get her towed home. Pulled all the spark plugs all were oil fouled on bank 1. Compression tested the engine and all of the cylinders on bank 1 had no compression. Pretty sure I made PTV. I dont know why it happened the car shifted at 6500 rpm like normal.

Being that I am sure the engine is done I've already started making plans.
- Teksid block
- Forged internals (crank, rods, pistons)
- Ported TFS heads from MHS (9.3-9.5:1 CR)
- Tork Tech Kit
- 2.8 Kenne Bell
- E85 w/ Meth

Buddy is selling his 2.8 KB said he would make me a killer deal on it. Would like to see in the 600whp range but we will see when we get there.

Shoot me some ideas on what you think. What I should do while I am there and things of that nature. Look for my up coming build.

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post #2 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 08:42 AM
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You can run more compression, imo.

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post #3 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 04:09 PM
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Dang that sucks. Were you on the juice?

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post #4 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 04:18 PM
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I can get u some trickflows there is no need to port them I made 735 rwhp on the 185 heads

Let me know if u need pricing

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post #5 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 04:23 PM
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Yup, with E85 AND meth, you're just giving up free power with such a low compression ratio. Also get some good valvesprings
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post #6 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 05:23 PM
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Michael M. ASE P2 Automobile Parts Specialist.

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post #7 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 08:38 PM Thread Starter
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Rob pm me on the prices for the heads. In the coming weeks I will be purchasing the KB.
What kind of compression ratio would you think would be adequate, GM?
And no I wasn't on the juice lol. All motor.

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post #8 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 08:41 PM
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well Ricky just posted up how he's running 12:1 on 9psi in the supercharging forum. You should check out his thread. Run an air-to-water intercooler + meth + E85 and you can go HIGH. I'm an N/A guy, so my advice of going 14+:1 should not be heeded, lol.
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post #9 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 09:53 PM
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Ill price u heavy springs and standerd springs

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post #10 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-25-2013, 11:37 PM
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With a 2.8l KB.... I wouldn't go insane on compression. Your goal of 600hp should be pretty easy. Just make sure your fuel system is stout. I'm running 60lb injector and a 405 pump. I think around 525whp on e85 is all it will do.

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post #11 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 08:27 AM
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you might want to check with modular motors for the internals.
they have a 5.0 stroker kit, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearings, and gaskets for around 2K and it's safe to 1000 rwhp.

when my friend builds motors for gt500's he likes to have 10 1/2-1 compression for gas motors.
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post #12 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2you View Post
you might want to check with modular motors for the internals.
they have a 5.0 stroker kit, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearings, and gaskets for around 2K and it's safe to 1000 rwhp.

when my friend builds motors for gt500's he likes to have 10 1/2-1 compression for gas motors.
10.5:1 is good on gasoline. But with the high octane of E85 + meth, the sky is the limit (practically).

I wanna see who has the manhood to do 15+:1 blown on 12+psi on E85 +meth injection + ice water-to-air intercooler
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post #13 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 01:40 PM
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10.5:1 is good on gasoline. But with the high octane of E85 + meth, the sky is the limit (practically).

I wanna see who has the manhood to do 15+:1 blown on 12+psi on E85 +meth injection + ice water-to-air intercooler
You should totally do it.

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post #14 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 01:56 PM
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You should totally do it.
Never!!!!!

All I'll ever need is mother nature's own atmospheric pressure to whoop some a**!
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post #15 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 10:18 PM Thread Starter
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So I pulled the engine out today. I haven't gotten to totally tear it down yet. Got a late start to the day and ran out of sunlight...plus the buddy and I were watching football and drinking beer. lol. I did however get a chance to tear the valve covers off, check out what I found.
 photo b060e1fe-1dde-459a-bcd5-d4bd5dafee10_zps7f64d25f.jpg

 photo CF378F7E-E04C-4087-A874-2E046A531F49-1740-00000222ACDE5ECF_zpsb7dde545.jpg

Thats from the passenger side head. The timing chain that connects the intake and exhaust cams.

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post #16 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-27-2013, 10:32 PM
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Dayum. I wonder if one of the cams siezed, or maybe even the sprocket shifted at high rpm (some B motors don't have a key installed from the factory)

-Matt
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post #17 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 12:07 AM
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Or the chain just broke. Same thing happened to my dad's '96 Mustang Cobra one morning when my mom went to start it before going to work. That made me paranoid about B-headed 4.6's.

Michael M. ASE P2 Automobile Parts Specialist.

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post #18 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 12:24 PM
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That chain looks torn open; that takes a lot of force.

I'd pop the followers off with a screwdriver; I'm betting the non-driven cam is welded in place.


Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
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post #19 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 12:56 PM
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Well on the bright side, the bottom end may be alright. Pop that head off and see what the pistons look like. You may be able to get away with just a head swap and be back up and running.

-91 Cougar LS, coming soon, complete overhaul with a 427" Windsor.
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post #20 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grog6 View Post
That chain looks torn open; that takes a lot of force.

I'd pop the followers off with a screwdriver; I'm betting the non-driven cam is welded in place.

My thoughts exactly.

BTW is that a Mark VIII oil pan or the stock Tbird pan? I don't see the bung for the level sensor Marks use on the side?

-Matt
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post #21 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 03:03 PM Thread Starter
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Well on the bright side, the bottom end may be alright. Pop that head off and see what the pistons look like. You may be able to get away with just a head swap and be back up and running.
Unfortunately the pistons were not spared.
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post #22 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 07:56 PM
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You were getting several hp out of the aluminum burning; holy crap!


Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
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post #23 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-28-2013, 08:36 PM Thread Starter
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I am in the processes of tearing it down to a bare block. I sold the intake manifold with all the goodies today to a friend with a Mark VIII. Put up the crank on craigslist and got a couple hits. All that money will be funding my new build. 2.8KB TFS 4.6 to come soon.

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post #24 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 06:09 PM
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I'm Jonesing: post up some more Engine Carnage Porn, with a better description of what broke!

We will not discuss how it broke, it could have happened anywhere; Carnage is carnage.

(I still can't believe the years-back mark-engine-torn-in-half pix; Now That's a freakin' malfunction, lol.)

It looks like you really leaned out...

Red '96 Cougar XR-7 240k mi. '02 4R70W, PST DS : '03 PI engine, 04 maf, 24lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, '02 4r70w + Jmod, DirtyD0g TC + cooler + 3/8" lines, 255 walbro fp. Alpine system.
Black '96 Cougar XR-7 (Lazarus) 210k mi PI Intake, '02 4R70W, Jmod, PST DS, GrogTune, Konis, Mark LCA+Poly, racecougar Custom Engine Chain, and JL and racecougar Bracing.
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post #25 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 06:32 PM
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Unfortunately the pistons were not spared.
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And you were running how much spray???

Where are the spark plugs on those cylinders?

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post #26 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 07:42 PM Thread Starter
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And you were running how much spray???

Where are the spark plugs on those cylinders?
During the time in which it broke I wasn't running any juice. When I did spray I was spraying 125 wet shot. I don't understand what your asking for on the spark plugs.

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post #27 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 07:54 PM
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i think he just wanted to see a pic of them.

Blake

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post #28 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 08:27 PM Thread Starter
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i think he just wanted to see a pic of them.
Kind of late on that one. I already too everything in for scrap metal. Heads, pistons, chains etc. All I have left is a bare block.

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post #29 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 08:55 PM
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And you were running how much spray???

Where are the spark plugs on those cylinders?
Spark plugs are in the middle of the chamber on 4v B Heads.

~Rick

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post #30 of 43 (permalink) Old 10-29-2013, 10:06 PM
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Not even gonna at least describe the carnage to us? What a gyp!

-Matt
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