My car died today please help!!! - TCCoA Forums
 
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2017, 09:23 PM Thread Starter
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My car died today please help!!!

Went to the local 711 and when I came out the car would not start. Quick diagnostic between spark, air, and fuel led me to believe that there was no fuel delivery occurring. I wanted to know if there is any other things to check fuel related besides the fuse and filter as they are both good. I just changed the fuel filter maybe a month ago so thatís new and at the same time I ran Lucas injector cleaner. I know thereís the fuel pump shutdown switch in the trunk I pressed the red button but it did nothing(maybe this is bad, Idk. Any help would be appreciated, the car isnít home yet as I am strapped for cash until payday so Iím trying to borrow a tow dolly from a family friend to get it home tomorrow.
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2017, 09:48 PM
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Check the inertial fuel switch in the trunk; someone bumped you car, probably.

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2017, 10:14 PM
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Sea foam is the only cleaner that I would use.

How many miles are on the car? Which model is it? Which engine do you have? 3.8 or 4.6 or 5.0?

A bad idol air controller (IAC) could cause starting issues. You could always try replacing the inertia switch and see if that helps; other than battery I'd guess fuel pump. If you believe it's fuel then I'd go with the pump as a last resort, as the pump is in the fuel tank.

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2017, 11:31 PM
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The red button works like an EFI outlet if the button wasn't triggered I mean if you pressed on it and it didn't click back in then it was not the issue although you're getting some spark it could be in the distributor itself
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 07:34 AM
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are you hearing the fuel pump cycle when you turn the key to on, no start?

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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 09:22 AM
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You might look at the crankshaft position sensor. Especially if next time it starts right up. They are very intermittent when they go bad.

Then again, our old Cougar's fuel pump went bad in exactly the manner you described. Have someone turn the key on while you listen under the right rear tire. They are pretty hard to hear sometimes.

If the fuel pump and engine fan run continuously with the key on, that's a bad PCM.

A little more info would be helpful, like year, and engine. Put it in your info so it displays under your name. Location too.

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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 04:56 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks all for the responses so I have a 97 bird with 4.6 sohc. So today I had the time to run all troubleshooting on the vehicle I checked the relay and it was clicking on as it should, then proceeded to check the shutdown switch and it was not engaged so I popped it and reset and it didnít start the vehicle. I then used a jumper wire on the wiring harness to eliminate the shutdown switch and it didnít start still. As a final attempt at bringing my bird back to life I proceeded to hit the fuel tank with a rubber mallet while the ignition accessory was on to try to get the fuel pump to engage. Sure enough after a little bit of banging then a quick turn of the key she fired up like nothing was wrong. In conclusion sheís backed up on Ramps as we speak since I was able to drive her home and it appears to be that I will be doing a fuel pump job on this car which should be fun. Any advice on changing that pump would be appreciated, although I have stumbled upon some helpful information on this site already. Thanks again guys Iíll be sure to update when the new pump goes in.
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 05:08 PM
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I went through this one time and it ended up being my connector pins were loose, got a new pigtail for the fuel pump and havent had any issues since

First: Stacie, 1996 Tbird LX, mild build NPI engine, PI cams and intake, Long tube headers, Jmod.

Second: Ellie, 1989 Tbird SC, r̶e̶s̶t̶o̶r̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶n̶e̶w̶ ̶d̶a̶i̶l̶y̶. off the deep end

Third: 1997 Dodge Ram 1500, thirsty daily.

Fourth: 1990 Tbird SC, GT40 5.0 mated to m5r2, BBK long tubes, motor out the hood, drift car.
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 06:24 PM
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Here was a thread that had some good info about changing the pump:

http://forums.tccoa.com/6-general-te...p-replace.html
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 08:22 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote Jr. View Post
I went through this one time and it ended up being my connector pins were loose, got a new pigtail for the fuel pump and havent had any issues since
Are you talking about the pins on top of the fuel pump, meaning I would have to drop the tank still to diagnose this.
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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 08:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPJP View Post
Here was a thread that had some good info about changing the pump:

http://forums.tccoa.com/6-general-te...p-replace.html
Good read, Iíll be mindful of that float during installion. Canít have the gauge not working properly.
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird0718 View Post
Are you talking about the pins on top of the fuel pump, meaning I would have to drop the tank still to diagnose this.
If you do, I'd go ahead and either replace the entire assembly, or just replace the pump and strainer (with a Walbro 255 or bigger pump, and a new strainer).

Don't forget to replace the inline filter on the driver's side under the floor pan, bolted to the front subframe box rail, about under the driver's seat (but outside, not inside!)

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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-21-2017, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird0718 View Post
Are you talking about the pins on top of the fuel pump, meaning I would have to drop the tank still to diagnose this.
I mean the connector. The one that clips onto the fuel pump. Youre gonna have to drop the tank if you cant reach it and even then itll be difficult to disconnect. Dropping the tank it easy, hold it with a jack, loosen the 4 mounting bolts, disconnect the crossover line above the drive shaft, pop off the filler neck hoses, and lower the jack. Should be like 20 minutes.

First: Stacie, 1996 Tbird LX, mild build NPI engine, PI cams and intake, Long tube headers, Jmod.

Second: Ellie, 1989 Tbird SC, r̶e̶s̶t̶o̶r̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶n̶e̶w̶ ̶d̶a̶i̶l̶y̶. off the deep end

Third: 1997 Dodge Ram 1500, thirsty daily.

Fourth: 1990 Tbird SC, GT40 5.0 mated to m5r2, BBK long tubes, motor out the hood, drift car.
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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-22-2017, 04:39 PM Thread Starter
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I replaced the inline fuel filter already about a month ago. I appreciate the suggestion on the upgrade pump but Iím limited on time and funds right before the holiday and Iím stuck grabbing whatís available locally to replace the assembly with. Iím replacing the entire assembly and strainer atleast. I only have tomorrow to get this done.
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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-22-2017, 04:41 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird0718 View Post
Are you talking about the pins on top of the fuel pump, meaning I would have to drop the tank still to diagnose this.
I mean the connector. The one that clips onto the fuel pump. Youre gonna have to drop the tank if you cant reach it and even then itll be difficult to disconnect. Dropping the tank it easy, hold it with a jack, loosen the 4 mounting bolts, disconnect the crossover line above the drive shaft, pop off the filler neck hoses, and lower the jack. Should be like 20 minutes.
Yea it doesnít seem to be that much effort to get this thing done Iíve done trans swaps and other WAY more difficult jobs than this I just hate timing of car failures lol always at the perfect timing. Anyway Iím going to check the plug connector when I go in there, will it be noticeably loose if thatís the issue.
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post #16 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-23-2017, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
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Dropped the tank out today and swapped the fuel pump, also checked the connector like suggested and it was very snug and secure. The car seems to be running better and more responsive so Iím guessing the pump has been on itís way out. This is my first MN12 so I have nothing to compare it too. Thanks for the help guys
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post #17 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-23-2017, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tbird0718 View Post
Dropped the tank out today and swapped the fuel pump, also checked the connector like suggested and it was very snug and secure. The car seems to be running better and more responsive so Iím guessing the pump has been on itís way out. This is my first MN12 so I have nothing to compare it too. Thanks for the help guys
Just a note - that "doesn't start, then does" symptom isn't just MN12's - I learned that well on my 2000 Malibu I used to own.

I also did about seven pumps on it before the last one, a ACDelco OEM pump, that was at 45,000 miles when ... the surge tank blew and that aluminum motor decided a wavey swedge was more appropriate than a 60* V

(I do cry; with good struts front and rear, with the Grand Am solid rear tranverse link, and with Alero disk brakes in the back, it rode good, it braked good, and it accelerated good enough I could get myself into trouble if I wanted to. And it got 25MPH while doing that ... le sigh.)

RwP

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