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post #1 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-11-2006, 10:50 PM Thread Starter
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Unhappy Need some help guys...missing at idle.

I've got a horrible miss at idle, it sounds cammed. Really bad. It's got BRAND NEW plugs, wires, fuel filter, and a fairly new maf. The thing is it won't idle with the maf plugged in without me keeping it running; It just dies. So I unplugged the maf, and now it idles, but still misses really badly. Anywhere above 2800rpm it sounds good/doesn't miss, but any lower, and it misses. It also doesn't constantly search for idle, but it idles at 700rpm, then about every 20 seconds will jump up to about 3000rpm then goes back down, and idles/misses. I've checked the tps (1.00idle-4.66wot), the injectors are all getting signals, and clicking. It doesn't smell like gas(I have no way to check fuel pressure/fpr) The only things I can think of that I haven't already done are I haven't checked the injector resistance, but they're clickin'. And I haven't checked the IAC, which with my luck is probably what it is. Other than unplugging it to see if it makes a difference, how do you test the IAC? Here's the wierd thing, I tried to scan it, and it comes back "Vehicle Not Responding" It's got a CEL, but won't throw a code. Please somebody help me. I just miss my car! ...almost forgot... coilpacks are all firing, and plugs are getting spark.

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post #2 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 09:45 AM
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sounds like a plug wire misfire. did you use antiseize on the plugs? one time i put too much on and the plug wouldnt ground to the head. i know you said you just changed them? maybe a rip in a boot? that would let the spark shoot to the head instead of the plug

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post #3 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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I do use a liberal amount of antisieze, but I wipe the excess off with my fingers. I checked all the wires, and they're good. I was hoping someone would post something about the "Vehicle Not Responding" that I get when I try to check the codes. I've never had that happen. I've basically got it narrowed down to the IAC, injectors, or the EEC. Does anyone know what the "Vehicle Not Responding" means?

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post #4 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 12:51 PM
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Don't know, but sounds bad. . . .
The routine to check the IAC is posted on the internet here:
http://www.ford-trucks.com/article/i...r_IAC_Fix.html

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post #5 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 03:27 PM Thread Starter
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Sweet, thanks a lot. I called Lonnie, and he said when the computer says vehicle not responding, it's related to the IAC. So that's where I'll start.

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post #6 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 03:42 PM
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I'll have to remember that.

Currently In the Short Bus Garage:
2 - '94 T-bird LX's 4.6L (one with 300,000+ miles and one with 200,000+ miles)
1 - '97 Mark VIII LSC - INTECH V8 (120,000+ miles)
1 - '97 F150 XLT 4x4 Flareside, 4.6L (130,000+ miles) - Currently being dismantled and rebuilt with upgrades!
1 - '00 Mustang GT (likes to accelerate with the brake on!), 4.6L (60,000+ miles - only comes out when I need to get somewhere fast.)

oh yeah, and they all have 4R70W's
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post #7 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 07:53 PM Thread Starter
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I cleaned the old IAC, and put it back on. No help. So, I got a new IAC; That did nothing. I checked the resistance on all of the injectors; They're fine. There's nothing left other than the EEC. I can't think of anything other than a bad EEC. Any input from anyone? Please. Anyone have an EEC lyin' around (MBE1 preferably)

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post #8 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 10:22 PM
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This type of stuff is always plug and wire related, especially since you just messed with them. sort of overkill to blame the eec so soon. i still think its the antiseize or a bad wire. just how did you check them?

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post #9 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 11:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modbird
This type of stuff is always plug and wire related
Not ALWAYS...I've seen this as a result of the ICM, MAF, vacuum leaks...

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post #10 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-14-2006, 12:40 AM Thread Starter
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The plugs, and wires are BRAND new. Just put new plug wires on today. I talked to a guy, and he said try the coolant temperature sensor, so that's what I'm gonna do. I'm not buying these parts, they're off another bird. I'm not just gonna throw money at it for fun.

Quote:
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Not ALWAYS...I've seen this as a result of the ICM, MAF, vacuum leaks...
What's the ICM? No vacuum leaks. Checked with carb cleaner.

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post #11 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-14-2006, 04:05 AM
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ICM = Ignition Control Module, the module that controls spark.

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post #12 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-14-2006, 02:19 PM
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maybe there is somthing wrong with your computer all together... just a thought.
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post #13 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-14-2006, 03:50 PM Thread Starter
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Did a KOEO test, it threw p1443. Evap purge vacuum system. What do I do to fix this?

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post #14 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-14-2006, 06:08 PM
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Quote:
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Did a KOEO test, it threw p1443. Evap purge vacuum system. What do I do to fix this?
Most likely one of the vacuum lines going to the vapor canister has completely rotted, causing a leak in the line. Check all the lines at the vapor canister (behind front bumper, passenger side) and going all the way to the engine.

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post #15 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-15-2006, 02:30 AM Thread Starter
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That's why when I checked for vacuum leaks, I didn't get anything. I looked at the lines today; They're all rotted down next to the chassis to block ground cable, and behind the bumper. I'm getting new hose tomorrow, and hopefully it'll fix it. Thanks for the help Chris.

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post #16 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-15-2006, 03:17 PM
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I would say vac leak to. Especially since at high revs it runs and the hunting.

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Last edited by rbrown; 10-16-2006 at 04:13 PM.
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post #17 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-16-2006, 03:06 PM Thread Starter
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I replaced all of the vac lines, and nothing... I'm at a loss. I'm about to take it to my mechanic.

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post #18 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-16-2006, 03:37 PM
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Pull the line on the brake booster and plug it.

I've never seen it but have heard of them going bad and leaking.

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post #19 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-16-2006, 03:40 PM
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1997 Ford Thunderbird 4.6 Sport .

60'...... 2.06
1/8th .. 9.194
mph .... 77.13

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PI heads *PI intake*Mark VIII torque converter*Cobra T-loc w\4.10's * Jmod*tranny fluid cooler*P&P stock T/B & plenum*UD pulleys* Dynotech 4in ds*80mm Lightning maf*Xcal2*02 GT intake tube.
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post #20 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-19-2006, 07:47 PM Thread Starter
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There are NO vacuum leaks whatsoever. When I start it, I have to hold my foot on the gas to get it to idle with the maf plugged in. If I start it with the maf unplugged it'll idle at 800, but still miss. I plug it back in, and idle drops to about 4-500. The only codes were evap purge(fixed), and maf(tried 3 different ones). I can smell gas in the car when I drive, and I have a pretty bad exhaust leak at the pass. side manifold. I'll fix the leak tomorrow to see if that helps, then I'm gonna check the fuel pressure. I just don't know...

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post #21 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-19-2006, 08:10 PM
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Ok let's backup a little bit.

What happened when it started doing this?
I've read this over and over and I do not know when it started.
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post #22 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-19-2006, 08:18 PM
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For the code


I would change these parts , maybe junk yard parts first .

evap purge valve, canister, and related parts .


For the miss

Check your injector plugs they unplug easy.
change sparkplugs (plugs) use another set of sparkplug wires .
change coil packs

All these from the junk yard first so you dont spend to much money .

1997 Ford Thunderbird 4.6 Sport .

60'...... 2.06
1/8th .. 9.194
mph .... 77.13

mods*
PI heads *PI intake*Mark VIII torque converter*Cobra T-loc w\4.10's * Jmod*tranny fluid cooler*P&P stock T/B & plenum*UD pulleys* Dynotech 4in ds*80mm Lightning maf*Xcal2*02 GT intake tube.

Last edited by cjchevez; 10-19-2006 at 08:29 PM.
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post #23 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-19-2006, 08:32 PM Thread Starter
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I've got another car... I've already swapped the expensive parts(injectors, cp's). And everything else is brand new.

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post #24 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-20-2006, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjchevez
For the code


I would change these parts , maybe junk yard parts first .

evap purge valve, canister, and related parts .


For the miss

Check your injector plugs they unplug easy.
change sparkplugs (plugs) use another set of sparkplug wires .
change coil packs

All these from the junk yard first so you dont spend to much money .
Im with him on this too. try the purge valve first...

Kevin

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post #25 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-20-2006, 03:06 PM
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you said you got a "fairly new MAF"
have you tried using your old MAF? and/or cleaning your new/old one?
did you gap your sparkplugs?
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post #26 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-20-2006, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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Plugs are gapped, Both mafs were tried, then cleaned, then tried again. But it won't idle with the maf plugged in, without my foot on the gas. It's running really rich though. I can smell gas like a mutha inside the car, and all of the old plugs were pretty black.

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post #27 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-20-2006, 03:41 PM
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"Vehicle Not Responding" definatly is weird!
have you tried a different computer?

(above it says "cp's" that mean computer?)
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post #28 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-20-2006, 07:55 PM Thread Starter
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cp's=coil packs. My bad. I finally got it to throw codes, doing a koeo test. I fixed those problems though.

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post #29 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-21-2006, 05:21 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbrown
Ok let's backup a little bit.

What happened when it started doing this?
I've read this over and over and I do not know when it started.
Sorry, I just noticed your post. I had two intake manifolds crack in about a month. The first one cracked at the heater core nipple, and caused a #4 miss. Changed it with new plugs, and everything was cool again. About 3 weeks later the next one cracked at the x-over causing #5, & #6 miss. Swapped it out, and now it's doing this. When I changed out the first one, I had NO problems. The second time my parents had a mechanic do it, and now this. He put on the new manifold with new gaskets, and it was missing when he put it all back. So I put new plugs, and wires because it needed it anyway. Everything else has either been swapped with oem parts, or replaced with new. Thanks. Any ideas?

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post #30 of 33 (permalink) Old 10-21-2006, 05:38 PM
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I still lean toward vaccuum leak. It might take pulling everything off the top of that engine and reseating the intake to find it.

If the engine is drawing air from another source other than the MAF the reading will be off. You unplug the MAF and it will idle because it goes into a mode which allows this. Once the computer is smart again (MAF plugged in), the mix is wrong.

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