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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 03:05 AM Thread Starter
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Those Dreaded Starter Bolts Questions

Alright this saturday or sunday im putting in a new motorcraft starter on my 97 v8. what im asking is are there any specific tools or any secrets you guys can share that dont involve removing the exhuast/intake/valvecover or anything. what size bolts hold the starter in place and how do i go about removing the top 3rd bolt?

are they 10mm bolts? will i need a 3/8 drive or 1/4 drive universal or any extensions? the reason why i ask all this is because all my tools are at a relatives house/work and i cant get to them till 2 weeks from now. so im having a buddy come over with his tools but i dont want him to bring anything I wont need.
Does anything such as the exhuast need to be removed to drop the starter? i really need to find my haynes manual.

Thanx Guys.
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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 06:01 AM
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All you have to move out of the way is the intake tube (flat head screwdriver) and the air box. I don't recall if you have to remove the entire box or just the lid of it because when I did my starter I had a '99 GT airbox and the whole thing comes out in one piece.
After that you need a ten millimeter socket (I used 3/8 drive), two of those "wobble" extensions or one u-joint adapter, and enough 6 inch extensions to reach all the way to the front of the motor. You might need your friend to hold the socket on the top bolt while you get all the extensions in there but it will come out in mere minutes. It really isn't as hard as everyone makes it out to be. I found that it is so easy that I even put that top bolt back in, while everyone else says to leave it out.
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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
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so what would be your guestamate on how long it really was to reach it? i only have 3 6" extensions on me right now so i wanna know how many more i need to ask my friend to bring over. i also have a u-joint so that should be fine. i really miss my tools.

also the starter can be dropped without removing any of the exhuast system?

thanx for the help guys
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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 01:23 PM
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Yes, the starter can be dropped without removing the exhaust. You will have to turn it so that it is almost perpendicular to the ground and kinda "birth" it from underneath. If I remember correctly I needed 4 extensions, but it has been a while. . . . .I personally think it is easier if you have the facilities to put a jack under the tranny and drop the tranny k-member along with the exhaust from the manifolds. Please, don't try this unless you have someone there to help you get the k-member and exhaust back up! .

The starter bolts have 10 mm heads and you will also need a 1/2" or 13mm socket for the battery cable. Don't forget to disconnect the battery! If you are going to drop the k-member then you will need a 15mm deep for the exhaust nuts and a 16mm for the tranny mount.

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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 01:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wether
Don't forget to disconnect the battery!
....duhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..........uhhhhhhhhh.......why should i disconnect the battery?



























lol im j/k

thanx for all the input guys
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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 02:23 PM
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Wow. Dropping the k-member is over-kill. Especially if you haven't had the exhaust loose from the manifolds in a while. They are a pain. Honestly, five minutes in and out with the extension method.
I don't remember how many extensions I used either. If you have three ask him to bring three... surely six will be enough. If he brings too many they aren't that heavy to haul around.
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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman_72
All you have to move out of the way is the intake tube (flat head screwdriver) and the air box. I don't recall if you have to remove the entire box or just the lid of it because when I did my starter I had a '99 GT airbox and the whole thing comes out in one piece.
After that you need a ten millimeter socket (I used 3/8 drive), two of those "wobble" extensions or one u-joint adapter, and enough 6 inch extensions to reach all the way to the front of the motor. You might need your friend to hold the socket on the top bolt while you get all the extensions in there but it will come out in mere minutes. It really isn't as hard as everyone makes it out to be. I found that it is so easy that I even put that top bolt back in, while everyone else says to leave it out.
Say what!? To take the starter out? I havent done this on a 97 but on my 95 there is no way that that is coming out through the top. I would just ubolt the front exhaust section and then its easy. Honestly only the top bolt is tough but its not that bad. Its a 10mm socket i believe although i found a box wrench to be the best way.

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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 03:52 PM
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I think he means the airbox comes out the top for getting the ratchet in there.

If my memory serves, I cut a 10mm box wrench in half and used that for the top bolt and didn't take anything else loose. Didn't even think of using a ratchet and extentions, but now I know.

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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 04:43 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mechman1984
I havent done this on a 97 but on my 95 there is no way that that is coming out through the top.
Will
i dont think he was saying to take it out through the top, just get that bolt out coming form the top while the air-box and tube are removed.

and i have a box full of wrenches i dont use so i might cut a 10mm and try that too.

-Mike
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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman_72
All you have to move out of the way is the intake tube (flat head screwdriver) and the air box. I don't recall if you have to remove the entire box or just the lid of it because when I did my starter I had a '99 GT airbox and the whole thing comes out in one piece.
After that you need a ten millimeter socket (I used 3/8 drive), two of those "wobble" extensions or one u-joint adapter, and enough 6 inch extensions to reach all the way to the front of the motor. You might need your friend to hold the socket on the top bolt while you get all the extensions in there but it will come out in mere minutes. It really isn't as hard as everyone makes it out to be. I found that it is so easy that I even put that top bolt back in, while everyone else says to leave it out.
I dont remember taking out my airbox, but that may have helped. Otherwise tinmans directions are as good as ive seen. I got my top bolt back in too. Mine took about an hour, and i did it in the dark in an apartment complex with a flashlight. it is a tight fit, and you do have to squeeze it past the exhaust. But i dont see the need to start removing the exhaust and whatnot.
Good luck

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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 04:46 PM Thread Starter
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yea i just dont want it to be the oil filter. like its easy to undo the filter but hard to get it out. heheh its not a problem for me anymore tho
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 06:10 PM
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Yeah, the starter definitely does not come out through the top. Just take the tube (and maybe the airbox) out of the way so you have room to spin the ratchet. It is much easier than loosening the exhaust.
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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 06:21 PM
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I think you can also get at that top bolt straight on with a few extensions. If you go from the front of the k-member and route the extensions to one side of the motor mount, it should line up and come out pretty easy.

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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-08-2006, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
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Alright one more question

What is the torque setting for the 10mm bolts?
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domesticbird
Alright one more question

What is the torque setting for the 10mm bolts?
Manual says 15-20 ft-lbs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman_72
Wow. Dropping the k-member is over-kill. Especially if you haven't had the exhaust loose from the manifolds in a while.
I guess it has a lot to do with where you live. My t-bird with over 300,000 miles on it has never given me a problem with the exhaust. . . .I always get the car "up" on jackstands/ramps spray the nuts with a little WD-40, go get a soda or something for about 15-30 minutes, come back with a 15mm deep socket and they come right off. Some people say that I am lucky with rusty bolts, though.

Currently In the Short Bus Garage:
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1 - '00 Mustang GT (likes to accelerate with the brake on!), 4.6L (60,000+ miles - only comes out when I need to get somewhere fast.)

oh yeah, and they all have 4R70W's
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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wether
. . . .I always get the car "up" on jackstands/ramps spray the nuts with a little WD-40, go get a soda or something for about 15-30 minutes, come back with a 15mm deep socket and they come right off...
Yes, but while you are sitting around sipping your soda I could remove your starter and be waiting for you with it in hand.
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wether
Yes, the starter can be dropped without removing the exhaust. You will have to turn it so that it is almost perpendicular to the ground and kinda "birth" it from underneath. If I remember correctly I needed 4 extensions, but it has been a while. . . . .I personally think it is easier if you have the facilities to put a jack under the tranny and drop the tranny k-member along with the exhaust from the manifolds. Please, don't try this unless you have someone there to help you get the k-member and exhaust back up! .

The starter bolts have 10 mm heads and you will also need a 1/2" or 13mm socket for the battery cable. Don't forget to disconnect the battery! If you are going to drop the k-member then you will need a 15mm deep for the exhaust nuts and a 16mm for the tranny mount.

I found out the hard way, it is a major PITA to reattach the exhaust crossmember, but it is possible if you have the upper body endurance for it! But no need, starter is easy to remove with exhaust in, once you get that top bolt out : \

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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2006, 09:17 AM
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I just used a 10mm socket wrench and it came off.
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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 04:50 PM Thread Starter
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well i started workin on it today w/o my buddy to see how far i would go, and yea i didnt finish.

-lower bolt was easy to get off
-second lower bolt was tricky till you find the right path for the socket to seat
-the infamous 3rd top bolt is next to impossible to remove.

if i had the car on a lift it would be a lot easier but it doesnt start/run durrr. i only feel one bolt around the top side of the starter but its not a 10mm bolt, its a 13mm bolt and is directly above the bottom bolt. ive tried to look down through the intake/exhuast and can only see 1-2 posts of the starter solenoid thats it! i dont know how to get to the 3rd bolt and the haynes manual/shop manual dont show sqaut. just one sentence saying "remove top bolt". um where the hell is it?

the 2 lower bolts were facing the rear of the car and the 3rd top bolt seems to be facing the front of the car towards the engine. do i have it mixed up with a bellhousing bolt? other than that i cant feel squat and man o man i have having big hands. my *smaller* friend is coming with the u-joint and some more extensions tomorrow but i dunno i thought it would be possible to remove the 3rd bolt without a universal.

any tips or good reference pics from you guys?

if i dont get this running by sunday night off to my friends shop where we can work on it on a lift. yay for tow trucks and AAA
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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
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some pics to show

looking through the exhuast and where the intake tube used to be:



engine shot:

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post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 07:18 PM
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Heh I do all these bolts with an air ratchet and a 10mm swivel socket in just a few seconds. Dunno what all the problem is.
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post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domesticbird
...the 2 lower bolts were facing the rear of the car and the 3rd top bolt seems to be facing the front of the car towards the engine. do i have it mixed up with a bellhousing bolt?..
Yeah, that's your problem. All three bolts face the same direction. You cannot actually see the top bolt. I was only able to touch it with the tip of my finger. From underneath I put the socket on and one extension at a time, working my way to the front of the car.
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post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 09:41 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah, that's your problem. All three bolts face the same direction. You cannot actually see the top bolt. I was only able to touch it with the tip of my finger. From underneath I put the socket on and one extension at a time, working my way to the front of the car.
ahhhh ic....i swear i couldnt find that 3rd bolt for the life of me. my friend just arrived so ill take advantage of his small hands tomorrow

hmmm that last part kinda sounded funny
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post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 09:43 PM
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...hmmm that last part kinda sounded funny
Aw come on, grow up a little.
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post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 09:44 PM Thread Starter
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NEVER!!!


ill be the immature perverted old man sitting at the restaraunt lifting up the servers skirt >=)
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post #26 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 10:42 PM
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post #27 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2006, 10:46 PM Thread Starter
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you can take me anywhere.....im over 21 not like leo >=)
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post #28 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2006, 08:41 AM
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I used 3 extensions, 2 universals and an extra pair of hands. To put the top bolt back in, stick it in the hole of the new starter with a gob of grease to hold it until you can get a wrench on it.

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post #29 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2006, 04:45 PM
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you get it done, if not im avail to help :P

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post #30 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2006, 09:18 PM Thread Starter
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well i did the extension method going towards the front of the motor. the head broke off the threading seeing how it was SEIZED and rusted. it was the oem starter and it lasted 172k miles.....not too bad if you ask me. started the car right up but the battery is kinda low on juice seeing how its old and sat there for a week. so monday im getting a new battery/plugs/fuel filter and some misc tune up parts. so by monday night-tuesday morning it should be ready for sale.

USE THE EXTENSION METHOD WITH A MIRROR AND A BUDDY!!!
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