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post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-28-2014, 06:10 PM Thread Starter
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4R70W Build Questions

Wassup guys. Haven't been around in a while. A few local folks know that I dropped a motor a couple of months ago at a track outing. While having it out rebuilding it, I thought it'd be foolish to not do a rebuild on the transmission as well.

I think this is a good point for a disclaimer: I know there are lots of people on here that could physically do this for me. I've heard SilverFox is a great option, Alan at DirtyDog has been recommended, and RobertP quoted me a ridiculously cheap price to build it for me. Several others, too. However, being the hard-headed engineer that I am, I want to do it myself, if for no other reason than to learn a few things in the process. So I thank you guys in advance for any advice I get, as well as lots of good info I've read on these forums in the past.

So here's what I'm looking for: it needs to hold up to a cammed PI head car with a ported SVO blower running a 3.1 pulley (roughly 10 pounds of boost). Based on what it trapped at the track on a 3.3 pulley (119+ mph), I'm guessing it'd be in the 425 rwhp area. Now, depending on just how fast it goes with this setup, I might also hit it with a 75ish horsepower shot of the giggle gas. So I guess I'd say the transmission needs to be reliable to a regular 425/425, and an occasional 500/550. However, it is very important to me that it not be overly harsh during normal driving conditions; I've ridden in a couple of built 4R70W cars before, and was definitely not pleased with how violently they shifted at part throttle.

I've read through Jerry's thesis on this sight, and here's what I'm currently planning from reading that:

-7 clutch direct with OEM Ford clutches and steels
-6 clutch forward with OEM Ford clutches and steels (no wave plate)
-4 clutch intermediate with OEM Ford clutches and steels
-OEM Ford O/D band
-OEM Ford pressure control solenoid
-Trans Tec overhaul kit from Transmission Center (F53900G)

As for the valvebody, I've already done the J-mod. Well, sort-of. I drilled out the holes to the middle setting, and left the springs stock. Honestly, I very much like the way it shifts now, and would be very happy if it didn't change. I think I'm going to drill the holes out to the higher level, but leave the springs alone.

So, here are a few questions I have:

1. Have I left off anything from what I listed above for my build?
2. Would you use the OEM parts / clutch number combinations I listed? Or opt for aftermarket clutches?
3. I've read things before about something related to a Sonnax product. But in searching, I couldn't narrow it down exactly. Is there some Sonnax product that I need to add to my parts list?
4. Would you change or add anything to my general parts list considering my power level goals?

Thanks in advance for the help!

-Will
1998 Mustang GT, Silver, 4R70W
Built Short Block - SVO Supercharger w/ 2.9" Pulley (12 psi) - AIS Methanol Kit - Home Ported PI Heads - MHS Stage II NPI Blower Cams - 75 mm T/B - Offroad Prochamber - 2 Chamber Flowmasters
Built Transmission by RobertP - 3600 RPM Circle D Triple Disk Converter - 31 Spline Axles - 3.73 Rear Gears

Self Tuned with SCT Pro Racer Software
Unknown Power and Torque Numbers (yet)

Full weight, full street trim, 17 x 9s on all 4 corners, MT ET Street Radials
11.51 @ 118.89 mph, 1.63 60'
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post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-28-2014, 07:43 PM
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Hats off to you Will for doing this project yourself , Robert's talent for tearing and putting the pieces together in these TM's is amazing IMO .Look's like a million piece puzzle That being said, your concern about the violent shift Robert just did a mild setting J-Mod on my 95 and I have to say I love the feel of those shifts.

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post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-28-2014, 08:07 PM
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Mine is built up pretty well, but I dont even feel the shifts at 1/4 throttle. I think it has a lot to do with the converter and tune as far as driveability is concerned also. It really shouldn't be that bad if you leave the springs in, and get it dialed in on the street/dyno the way you want it. What size converter you gonna run?

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http://forums.tccoa.com/vbpicgallery.php?do=view&g=387

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post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-28-2014, 09:35 PM
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Sneaky there's solid sealing rings on the output shaft, u want the 5.4 epc solenoid, I can get u a full kit all with oem clutches for around 250ish plus I'd run the heavy duty overdrive band I use there 20 and the epc for 5.4 is around 50

Darrin I drilled yours to the 300-450 setting but used both springs in the 1-2 to help cushion shift and no spring in the 2-3, I do them slightly different than the article with lots of happy customers like darrin

Sneaky u bring me the trans I'll fix it right for 7-800 range max including parts, and there is a few special tools needed

Robert

www.robstireandauto.com for all your car needs and parts
95 bird corn powered 735rwhp and 580 tq
86 bird vortech s trim
10.75 @128.38
95 bird - Vortech t trim
9.98 worlds fastest IRS 4.6 thunderbird
1/8 [email protected]
10.11 @ 139.19 best mph
1.47 best 60ft if I can get a full pass with this 60ftt
All made possible with Braincoating'ôs ported manifolds
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post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-28-2014, 11:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderChecken View Post
Hats off to you Will for doing this project yourself , Robert's talent for tearing and putting the pieces together in these TM's is amazing IMO .Look's like a million piece puzzle That being said, your concern about the violent shift Robert just did a mild setting J-Mod on my 95 and I have to say I love the feel of those shifts.
Haha, it may wind up down there after I get it apart into a million pieces and then can't figure out how to get it back together! LoL!

Quote:
Originally Posted by modularbird View Post
Mine is built up pretty well, but I dont even feel the shifts at 1/4 throttle. I think it has a lot to do with the converter and tune as far as driveability is concerned also. It really shouldn't be that bad if you leave the springs in, and get it dialed in on the street/dyno the way you want it. What size converter you gonna run?
Haven't decided yet on the converter. I want something decent, but at the same time, I'm trying to avoid dumping gobs of money into this build. I know Rob and others around here recommend Alan at DirtyDog (I think one of the 9.5" converters is what Rob has recommended to me before). My brother and some of his buddies have had great experiences with PI converters in the Powerstroke diesel trucks (would likely be a 9.5" on my car). And on the money-saving side of things, I'm considering a worked-over 11" Mach 1 converter from Lonnie at Blue Oval Chips. Heard lots of good things about him, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertP View Post
Sneaky there's solid sealing rings on the output shaft, u want the 5.4 epc solenoid, I can get u a full kit all with oem clutches for around 250ish plus I'd run the heavy duty overdrive band I use there 20 and the epc for 5.4 is around 50

Darrin I drilled yours to the 300-450 setting but used both springs in the 1-2 to help cushion shift and no spring in the 2-3, I do them slightly different than the article with lots of happy customers like darrin

Sneaky u bring me the trans I'll fix it right for 7-800 range max including parts, and there is a few special tools needed

Robert
Sweet. Those parts prices are as good or better than what I've found thus far, and that's not including shipping. So I'll definitely get parts from you.

I have been considering just bringing it to you and letting you do it. If I brought it to you, is there any way I might could be around when you tore it down and built it back? As I mentioned earlier, I'm a nosy and hard-headed little fella, and I'd love to see exactly what all is involved in building one up. That's more of the reason I want to do it myself than trying to save any money.

-Will
1998 Mustang GT, Silver, 4R70W
Built Short Block - SVO Supercharger w/ 2.9" Pulley (12 psi) - AIS Methanol Kit - Home Ported PI Heads - MHS Stage II NPI Blower Cams - 75 mm T/B - Offroad Prochamber - 2 Chamber Flowmasters
Built Transmission by RobertP - 3600 RPM Circle D Triple Disk Converter - 31 Spline Axles - 3.73 Rear Gears

Self Tuned with SCT Pro Racer Software
Unknown Power and Torque Numbers (yet)

Full weight, full street trim, 17 x 9s on all 4 corners, MT ET Street Radials
11.51 @ 118.89 mph, 1.63 60'
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post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-01-2014, 08:57 AM
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Yea u could be around just let me know

Robert

www.robstireandauto.com for all your car needs and parts
95 bird corn powered 735rwhp and 580 tq
86 bird vortech s trim
10.75 @128.38
95 bird - Vortech t trim
9.98 worlds fastest IRS 4.6 thunderbird
1/8 [email protected]
10.11 @ 139.19 best mph
1.47 best 60ft if I can get a full pass with this 60ftt
All made possible with Braincoating'ôs ported manifolds
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post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-01-2014, 09:45 AM
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the sonnax part you're referring too is their surecure kit which upgrades the overdrive servo pin to one with o-rings to compensate for worn cases. Their are a few more odds and ends in there I can't remember off hand, here's a link http://www.sonnax.com/parts/3036#tabs1-620. Worth it. Robert P is right, you can replace the clutches and steels no problem, but you need a universal clutch spring compressor to get your lip seals and your gonna want to get your lip seals to the upgraded versions. also need a press to get all the bushings in the case and there is probably 10-12 all different sizes. Having said that, I put a 2005 4r75w out of a crown vic in my car after I gutted it and upgraded the clutches, steels, all the electronics, mechanical diode, and all the torrington brearings and rubber crap with nothing but a pair of snap ring pliers. I left the lip seals alone cause I didn't have a clutch spring compressor and I'm broke and it was a low mileage tranny out of a wreck

Oh and many a lesson in trannmission 101 from Alan

04 mustang pi engine, 4R75W, 2500 stall TC, Teksid block still in the garage being dreamed about

Last edited by Rodeo Joe; 03-01-2014 at 10:49 AM. Reason: Merged posts
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